Ripping 102

[Bob Sorel]

By popular demand (yeah, right :) ) I have decided to continue the ever popular Ripping 101 thread with this sequel in order to update the forum of the new tools available and to suggest new procedures where applicable.

For this project, Schud has graciously offered his help and will be my right hand man throughout the continued series. He is very well informed and can communicate effectively his ideas, so he will be an invaluable aid. Basically, listen to him - he knows his stuff!

Let me start by saying that since this is Ripping 102, it will be assumed that you have read part or all of Ripping 101, which can be found here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=152400&highlight=ripping+101

If you haven't, you need to read at least the first couple of pages to get an understanding of the procedures involved. This first installment will be a quick review of the currently recommended procedure for basic ripping by yours truly.

Here's my long standing recipe:

1. Rip the entire DVD in the "all files" mode using SmartRipper 2.41 or with DVDDecrypter 3.1.7.0 with the RC, RCE, and PUO options turned off in the settings dialog. If you want to have the highest degree of confidence that your rip will be perfect, then just use SmartRipper. (More about the DVDD issues later).

2. Load all of the IFOs, one at a time into IfoEdit 0.95 (I think 0.96 is still in beta) to "remove P-UPs" and to make "region free". Then run 'Get VTS sectors on any IFO in the set and you will now have a properly decrypted rip on your hard drive.

3. To reduce the size of the rip to its smallest state so that just the movie remains, with all of the menus, extras, FBI warnings, etc. removed, then use the "movie only" method using IfoEdit again, or you can reauthor using DVDShrink, the current version being 3.0 beta 5, but the final release could be coming out any day. I'll leave David to tell you all about DVDShrink, as this is one of his (and my) favorite tools in my toolbox.

4. Be sure to run "Get VTS sectors" again on the final rip, as navigational pointers will sometimes need to be corrected, and you do want your rip to work flawlessly, right? :)

Here are some of the other issues that I am sure will come up, so I'll bring them out now and at least give you my take on them:

1. Ripping in ISO mode vs. "all files" mode.

My personal choice is to use the "all files" mode, but there are certainly some very valid arguments for ripping in ISO mode. I prefer "all files" for the following reasons:

A. Both SR and DVDD can rip in the "all files" mode, while only DVDD can rip in the ISO mode. The problem is, SR is the better ripper, or at least in my experiences (like I said, more on that later).

B. I've already used up every available drive letter in my system, so I don't have room (on my ripping machine) to create a virtual drive. I know this is not a common situation, but others may also object to creating yet another drive for no needed reason.

C. Even if you have the drive letter available, why would you create yet another drive, then use Daemon Tools to mount and dismount it, when there is no need to do so in the first place? I like to keep things simple, and the extra overhead involved with virtual drives is a pain in the butt.

Now anyone who wants to present their arguments in favor of ripping in the ISO mode is more than welcome, as I would like to keep things fair and balanced, and thus offer the community more than one way to accomplish its goals.

DVDDecrypter vs. SmartRipper

Here is a hot button issue, but I think it is worth at least some discussion. Though SR hasn't been developed recently, I have now successfully ripped 1023 discs to my hard drives (at one time or another - every DVD in my collection :) ) without even one single problem or issue. This is a pretty good record if you ask me.

A. I used DVDD 3.1.6.0 to do my ripping for a short time, and in just 30 rips, I found one title that the RCE protection was improperly removed (The Simpsons Season 2 set) and one title in which subtitles were on by default (I don't remember the title). Now maybe I was just really unlucky, but after having two problems in just 30 rips, I decided that the reliability factor just wasn't high enough for me.

B. I understand that Lightning UK addressed these issues in the recently released version 3.1.7.0, but until it amasses a proven track record, I will stick with what I know works.

C. Now, if you want to use DVDD anyway, I highly suggest that you use only version 3.1.7.0 and that you turn off the RC, RCE, and PUO removal in the settings dialog in order to have the highest level of confidence that your rip will be flawless. Maybe these issues have been resolved in 3.1.7.0, but maybe not, and only time will tell. There are many many people who were (and still are) unaware that these issues exist, but I feel that everyone should be aware of the potential problems.

D. One last issue, DVDD can not rip from the hard drive, while SR can. I know most of you will ask why this is important, but as you perform advanced tasks manipulating the rips you will find that this is a very useful feature. Apparently Lightning UK disagrees. :(

Whew, this was one long post and I've just about had it for now. Schud will be coming in here shortly to provide you with more detailed procedures, as well as alternative methods to the ones I have described so far. We wil start with simple concepts and then work our way into more advanced topics, so if the information you seek is not yet availble, then just hang on and we will get to it.

Also, I would like to ask any of the other very capable people (you know who you are! :) ) to help out answering questions and providing detailed procedures if necessary.

Let the fun begin!

[schud]

It really is about time to update the "Ripping" thread to reflect some of the improvements in ripping tools (mostly DVDShrink, IMHO! :D ). I really want to re-emphasize for anyone who hasn't read Ripping 101, you really should spend some time going through those procedures, if for no other reason than to gain a level of appreciation for the level of complexity that can be involved.

I hope to be able to help Bob to accumulate any good "step by step" instructions that anyone chooses post, and accumulate them into a "Ripping 102" PDF file that can be downloaded and used by all. Although the thread may wander around various topics from time to time, my goal is to keep the PDF relatively updated and current.

However, that may be a real challenge considering how some of the various software tools, and thus our processes and procedures, can change!

This should be fun!

[schud]

Before we get started, don't forget that the information to be discussed in this thread is limited to the creation of "fair-use," personal back-up copies of DVDs which you personally own. Any discussions of backing up content which you do not legally own, and thus do not have "fair-use" rights, is innapropriate.

[Lucky]

Not to take anything away from what you guys are and will be doing, but if anyone gets impatient and might just have a general question check out doom9.org for a large amount of information and download links to probably all of the programs that will be discussed in this thread (not to mention the 101 thread). :)

[Karnis]

I have to agree about DVD Shrink, it's a snap to use and the ability to rip just the movie and the soundtrack of your choice so easily has made it the preferred ripping utility for me. I also have Smart Ripper & IFO Edit which are also nice programs.

[richardg]

Another DVDshrink fan. One of the first things I do after buying a DVD with either forced trailers or long menu is to make a back-up which has only the movie. The original then gets stored in one of my DVD binders - only brought out to see special features.

[setherd]

I have been playing around with ripping my dvds for a few months now.. I don't know why but I never tried dvd-shrink before today. I am very happy with it it just cut lOTR into a folder half the original size.

my concern is that right now I don't have a HDTV, but when I get one will I see a quality loss from the original DVD to one that's half the size from dvd-shrink?

one thing that still hasn't been answered clearly for me are the IFO files.
I use power dvd as my player, sometimes woth zoomplayer as the frontend.
the VIDEO_TS.IFO never plays in powerdvd, but the VTS_01_0.IFO usually does but not always. if I start a vob playing it only plays that vob then stops.

my thought is create 2 shortcuts for each movie. 1 plays just the movie immediately ( I guess the VTS_01_0.IFO file) the second I want to get the original dvd menus for the extra features.. shouldn't this goto the VIDEO_TS.IFO file?


thanks for the great thread guys!!!!!!!!!

[salsbst]

Is DVD Shrink a re-encoder or a trans-coder? How does it compare to CCE Basic (in 2-pass mode)?

[Tracie]

Just wanted to make a couple of comments about DVD Shrink. Personally, the only thing that I use it for is the Re-Author feature. I have had a few problems with rips that I've done with Shrink & I feel that using either DVD Decrypter or SR gives me more control over the rip. Also, it hasn't been mentioned, but you can use DVD Shrink to combine multi-disc DVDs, so that at the end of Disc 1 it will automatically start Disc 2. Nice little feature IMO.

[gongzero]

Tracie, thanks for that tip... I've yet to start ripping my DVDs and was wondering how I'd handle the 2-disc sets and flippers. I thought I'd have to create a folder per disc / side, and have to cue up each one separately, which really isn't as elegant a solution as i'd like.

[Tracie]

Yeah, it's actually pretty easy. Just rip both discs to their own folders, then reauthor each one separately (using the steps outlined above) & when you've done all of that open up disc 1 in DVD Shrink. Hit "Re-Author" & drag your movie into the re-author window that appears. Okay, go back to the first window & open up disc 2, then drag that one into the reauthor window. (This has to be said, although it may be implied - you have to drag disc 1 first.) Hit backup & you're good to go. It saves both discs to one directory with 2 different sets of vobs & ifos, but you're DVD player thinks it's one movie. Slick.

[Bob Sorel]

...check out doom9.org for a large amount of information and download links to probably all of the programs that will be discussed in this thread (not to mention the 101 thread).

Yup, there's nothing new here. We are just organizing things into a single thread for easy reference. Doom9 is the place for everything and anything concerning video. :)

my concern is that right now I don't have a HDTV, but when I get one will I see a quality loss from the original DVD to one that's half the size from dvd-shrink?

There is no doubt that there is a trade off between size and quality. We will get into various methods of compression soon, but in the beginning we will be staying with full quality (no compression) rips at first.

the VIDEO_TS.IFO never plays in powerdvd, but the VTS_01_0.IFO usually does but not always. if I start a vob playing it only plays that vob then stops.

I suspect something is wrong with your setup. I use PowerDVD on my ripping computer and TheaterTek on my HTPC, and I always play the rips directly from VIDEO_TS.IFO. That should open the files on the disc in the same exact manner as if you were playing the actual DVD in your drive.

Is DVD Shrink a re-encoder or a trans-coder? How does it compare to CCE Basic (in 2-pass mode)?

Transcoder. It is very fast and thus does not rewrite motion vectors (if I am using the correct terminology here), while CCE Basic is a true encoder, and thus takes much more time. If the movie requires very little compression (like 10-15%) then I have noticed very little difference between DVDShrink's transcoded version and CCE Basic's full blown version. If the movie is fairly large and/or has a low bitrate to start, then CCE is the tool of choice. Basically, CCE Basic is still king and NO transcoder can touch it in quality, though some of the people around Doom 9 will tell you that InstantCopy is just as good (but not to me...I can easily tell the difference).

Just wanted to make a couple of comments about DVD Shrink. Personally, the only thing that I use it for is the Re-Author feature. I have had a few problems with rips that I've done with Shrink & I feel that using either DVD Decrypter or SR gives me more control over the rip.

I agree wholeheartedly. I recommend using the right tool for the right job, as no single tool can be the best at everything. The ripper in DVDShrink, though very good, is not as good as either DVDD or SR in my opinion, though it does present a very competent "one click" solution for those who prefer ease of use over high confidence of the quality of the rips.

David is in the process of writing up a very comprehensive, step by step guide for using DVDShrink, and as soon as it is done I am sure that he will post it. This should answer most, if not all, of your questions. :)

[Steve Goff]

I have a simple question: if only the movie and prefered audio is ripped, how large is the average set of files, and how many movies could I get on 460G of hard drive space?

[brickie]

are dvd-data dvd-r's okay? i bought these by mistake and don't want to use them if they won't work..they were not labeled good at all.didn't know til i opened.

brickie

[schud]

Originally posted by Steve Goff
I have a simple question: if only the movie and prefered audio is ripped, how large is the average set of files, and how many movies could I get on 460G of hard drive space?

Hi Steve,

That's not a simple question to answer. Uncompressed, you can plan on around, 4 to 7 GB per movie. Length, original bit rate the movie was encoded, and your preferred audio track (DTS, DD, 2Ch) will all play into the overall file size of a movie rip.

How many movies on a 460GB disc? I gues the answer to that is.....it depends! ;)

Bob: :D

[Bob Sorel]

Steve, that question isn't so simple. :)

It all depends on the bitrate of the original transfer, the length of the movie, and the amount and size of the audio and subtitle streams that are present. The more stuff that you strip out, the smaller the final rip, of course, but for an average length movie of 1:45, it can vary anywhere from 3 gigabytes (very poor, low bitrate transfer) to 6 or 7 gigabytes (can you say "Superbit"?), with the average being around the 4.2 to 5 gig area, or at least that is my best guess based on my 1023 rips.

Edit: Hehe, David, you beat me to it! :)

[jmv]

Ok, this is slightly off topic, but I hope you will entertain the question. I have ripped most of my animation collection to the HD so the kids can select their movie w/o finger the disks. I then bought DVD writer so that I could create backups that they can touch since I have 4 DVD players and counting! Anyone willing to take on a "burning 101"?

My understanding is that burner, media, method (ROM/RW/R/+ -) all affect the capability of the backup. I don't have the expertise to author the thread since I have burned with 2 different burners on 3 different types of media using all the methods described above and I still can't get a backup to play on my Honda Odyssey player.

thanks,

jmv

[schud]

Originally posted by brickie
are dvd-data dvd-r's okay? i bought these by mistake and don't want to use them if they won't work..they were not labeled good at all.didn't know til i opened.

brickie

Hmmm.....I don't think there's a difference, brickie. I think a DVD +\- R is all the same. (Well, not really the same.....your burner has to recognize the DVD vendor ID to properly burn the disc) If those discs don't work well with your burner, I don't think it's because you purchased "data dvd's" rather than "video dvds." It would be because a) they're just crappy, or b) your burner did not properly recognize the manufacturer's vendor ID, and therefore does not know how to properly burn to that brand of media.

FWIW, you can find a nifty utility that will tell who manufactured your DVD media, regardless of the brand name on the package, here: http://dvd.identifier.cdfreaks.com/

[schud]

Originally posted by jmv
I still can't get a backup to play on my Honda Odyssey player.



JMV:

Can you play one of your burned DVD discs on any stand alone DVD player?

[rbmcgee]

Does anybody know if you can rip the HD version of Terminator 2 in the traditional way? If so, how large of a file is it? If not, is there anyway to rip it?

[brickie]

thanks david, for allyour help..i will try to go ahead and use one of the dvd'r's later tonite..hopefully they will work with no problems..i did grab a utility called dvdinfo,that has been awesome!!!tells you quite abit about dvd-r's,and other useful info..they said the blank dvd's are tdk actually..so we'll see.

i too am a huge fan of dvdshrink!!!it rocks...the few dvd's iv'e reauthored have looked amazing!!i did my copy of gladiator to check against original and i was impressed..if the original dvd is a dvd-5 then iso mode in dvddecrypter rules!!!IMO..just so simple...also nice to check iso works before burning it...yes, i love daemon tools..

actually what i do is..(tell me if this is wrong),for dvd-5 as mentioned i just rip in iso mode the use dvddecrypter to burn in iso mode...rocks!!!if dvbd-9 then i use shrink to strip everything i don't need,and reauthor my "new" dvd...then I use imgtools to make an image(iso file) of my "new" dvd.then i use dvddecrypter to burn as usual...this has been totally reliable for me..so if theres any reason why i shouldn't do this let me know..

brickie

[schud]

brickie:

TDK is EXCELLENT media. FWIW, I believe that NEC is the OEM for TDK's branded DVD burners, so you can have a high level of confidence that your generic branded media will work well with your burner.

As far as your ripping process goes, if it works and looks good to you, that's all that matters!

[Bob Sorel]

Does anybody know if you can rip the HD version of Terminator 2 in the traditional way?

Unfortunately, not that I know of, Bob. :(

A note to everyone:

I don't want anyone to misunderstand and think that my procedures are necessarily better than any other procedures when it comes to ripping. I am sure that some people will be more comfortable ripping with DVDShrink or DVDDecrypter as opposed to SmartRipper, and there is certainly nothing wrong with that. Just be sure to check your rip carefully for problems.

That doesn't mean that you have to play the entire movie. If you have ripped the entire DVD, you should check to make sure that you can successfully navigate to all the different areas (main movie, extras, etc.) and that you can choose the audio and subtitle streams properly. Skim through a few chapters at the beginning, one or two in the middle, and then check the last few to make sure that the entire movie is there and that it ends gracefully.

I always reduce my rips to "movie only", as I don't want to waste space on my hard drives with extraneous stuff like menus, extras, trailers, etc. and I never compress them, as I am a "quality" fanatic. I back up a lot of my collection to lend to friends and family (I refuse to lend out my originals :) ), so for these purposes I have learned how to use compression, and even under those circumstances, I always back up in "movie only" mode in order to make disc navigation as easy as possible (put the disc in and the movie starts) and to keep the quality as high as possible. My dear old mom, who is totally confused by the standard navigational procedures of a DVD, really likes it when I tell her, "Just put the disc in the tray label side up and close the tray and the movie will play".

So pick your tools and your methods to suit your taste. The method of ripping I outlined in my first post can be thought of as "old reliable" due to its 100% success rate. The chances of you running into problems using other tools or procedures are pretty slim, and you might NEVER run into a problem title even after hundreds of rips, but when and if the day comes that you do have issues, you will be glad to be able to whip out "old reliable" and get the job done correctly. I've just used it for so long that I do the procedures without even thinking, and I feel very secure that I won't have to do the rip twice.

BTW, if any of you programming types out there want to help, might I suggest writing a script to automate part of the drudgery involved in using IfoEdit to remove RCE protection and PUOs. For this procedure, all the IFOs in a set must be opened one at a time, and when the IFO is open, the user must hit the "region free" button (and answer the resultant requestors, which vary in number depending on what IfoEdit finds), hit the "remove P-UPs" button (and confirm), and then save the IFO twice, once as an IFO and then again as a BUP. Once the user has done this to every IFO in the set, then the user must open any IFO and hit the "Get VTS sectors" button (no saving required, but can require confirmation from 0 to x, where x = the number of IFOs in the set). Pretty simple task, but very boring, especially if the set has a lot of IFOs in it.

Ok, now, David, where is that DVDShrink procedure I know you've been working on? :D

[joeyvaz]

Bob Sorrell, or any other one of you knoweldgable folks, how log does it take to rip a DVD using Bob's methos from the dvd rippipng 101 thread. I have a 4X Sony dvd player and the first time I'm trying it it takes VERY long. SmartRipper says my DVD speed is .1X

It just seems as though something is wrong. Any help will be greatly appreciated.

[salsbst]

0.1x certainly indicates a problem. It sounds like either the disk or the drive may be damaged. Does the disc play properly in a DVD player? Have you tried a different disc?

[Bob Sorel]

I agree with Stuart...you definitely have a problem which requires fixing.

But for those who find themselves locked at around 2X (1.9 to 2.1), there are two possibilities:

1. Your drive is firmware locked at that speed
2. You are running in PIO mode rather than DMA

The solutions:

1. Grab a hacked version of your firmware and upgrade your drive so that it is no longer locked. There is a site that has all the popular makes and models of hacked firmware available, but I don't know where it is. I think David can help you out with that.

2. In WinXP, go to device manager and double click on the IDE controller that controls your DVD drive. Go to the "advanced settings" tab and you should see "Tansfer mode: DMA if available" and more importantly check to see what the "Current transfer mode" is set to. If you see something like "Ultra DMA mode 2" then you are all set, but if it reads "PIO mode" you need to fix it. The fix is to delete the IDE controller from Windows, reboot, and let Windows "find" the controller all over again and let it install the necessary drivers. Now when you go back and check, if everything went right, PIO should be gone and replaced with "Ultra DMA mode 2".

Once you make sure that your drive is not locked and that you are truly in DMA mode, your rips should be much faster, though the speed will still vary according to the encryption, the condition of the disc, and probably some other factors that I don't know about. I've seen speeds as high as 15X (for short periods) from my Pioneer 106.

[joeyvaz]

I checked the IDE controllers as suggested. The primary and secondary both say DMA if available. I have played various DVDs thru this Sony DVD to my Samsung HLN5065 without a problem. I'll try tp rip a different DVD and see what happens.

Thanks and I'll keep you posted.

[rbmcgee]

I just picked up the Cher concert. On the dvd, 3 songs have been removed from the concert and placed under 'bonus materials' as 'extra songs'. Not sure why they did that??? Anyway, what I would like to do is to re-insert them back into the concert (it fairly obvious where they go due to the costumes she wears). Like most concert dvds, each song is a chapter and each extra song has its own VOB.

I'm not really sure on the process to use to accomplish this.

PS: I'm pretty good at Smartripper/ifoedit as taught in the ripping 101 thread, so any tips can omit the basics.

TIA

[salsbst]

1. Grab a hacked version of your firmware and upgrade your drive so that it is no longer locked. There is a site that has all the popular makes and models of hacked firmware available, but I don't know where it is. I think David can help you out with that.http://forum.rpc1.org/portal.php certainly has a lot of them (RPC1 indicates a region-free drive, which is one of the reasons people, usually outside the US, use hacked firmware). Although I'm sure you'll see warnings along the way, let me be the first.... be careful, you may ruin your drive. I would recommend not hacking the firmware on a burner, since they still cost what I would consider to be substantial dough. I killed a DVD reader by using the wrong firmware. Replacement cost was $45 or so from NewEgg... no huge problem.... but I really don't want to kill my burner.

Another reason for having a separate burner and reader is that your burner may last somewhat longer if it doesn't have to do reading duties.

Yet a third reason is that there is the possibility that you can use an automated tool that will rip, reauthor/reencode and re-burn to a DVD5 all in one fell swoop, but you obviously need two drives for this to be fully automated.

[jvincent]

Originally posted by rbmcgee
I just picked up the Cher concert. On the dvd, 3 songs have been removed from the concert and placed under 'bonus materials' as 'extra songs'. Not sure why they did that??? Anyway, what I would like to do is to re-insert them back into the concert (it fairly obvious where they go due to the costumes she wears). Like most concert dvds, each song is a chapter and each extra song has its own VOB.

I'm not really sure on the process to use to accomplish this.

PS: I'm pretty good at Smartripper/ifoedit as taught in the ripping 101 thread, so any tips can omit the basics.

TIA

DVDshrink can do this in a snap.

Typically the main feature is one big blob with chapter stops. With DVDshrink you can break it up chapter by chapter (actually it works with even finer granularity than that) and insert the bonus songs anywhere you want and reauthor the DVD with the new order.

The trick to this, at least as far as I can tell so far, is that for every segment of the main feature you need to copy the whole thing and trim it every time. I.e. if you need to insert two songs in the middle you would copy the main feature 3 times, and trim each of those copies appropriately.

If you haven't tried DVDshrink yet you don't know what you're missing.

[brickie]

hey can you believe my piece of garbage nec nd 1300a has died after about 6 days..that sucks!!!!!it is not reading dvds or any other type of media...this is in windows and in pure dos mode as well...si i tend to think it is hardware for sure...my regular dvd drive works and reads media fine on both ide channels...i will NOT buy a nec product again!!!!it's going back as we speak...so what's better a tdk 440 or a sony 510? those are my new 2 choices...from what iv'e heard both are awesome with sony holding the slight edge..price is failry similar as well..opinions plz..

brickie

[joeyvaz]

I tried to play the original DVD that I was trying to rip and Power DVD played it with no problem. It just wouldn't rip at a speed higher than 0.1X

So I tried a different movie and now it starts out ripping at 4X , but then drops to 0.1 almost immediately. Any other ideas?

Bob,
When I first start up SmartRipper I immediately get this dialogue box:
"no ASPI-adapter available"

Then I get:
"Some files are still locked! Try to unlock them with a player." With the options to proceed being: Abort/Retry/Ignore

Any idea why this is happening?

Also, I can't get ForceASPI to install. I downloaded it, unzipped it (with Winrar), but I can't find a logical .exe I checked under WINNT in the unzipped files (I'm running XP Pro) but nothing happend. Did I download a bum copy.

THanks and sorry about all the questions.

-Joe

[brickie]

http://forum.rpc1.org/viewtopic.php?t=19490&sid=e4816870ec09afcad91eb13467f4a8d9

here is a link about the same exact problem i'm having with my drive!!!these drives just suck!!!i would avoid it if i were you,or just anybody looking for one...

brickie

[Bob Sorel]

Also, I can't get ForceASPI to install. I downloaded it, unzipped it (with Winrar), but I can't find a logical .exe I checked under WINNT in the unzipped files (I'm running XP Pro) but nothing happend. Did I download a bum copy.

The file you want to run is called instaspi.bat (a DOS batch file) and will run within a DOS window. Reboot the machine and you should be all set. You only have to install it once and it will be there forever. :)

The primary and secondary both say DMA if available.

That is not the important one. You need to read the next line down, which will probably be ghosted, yet still readable - the one that says "Current transfer mode".

I think your main problem is that you don't have an ASPI layer installed, but you may have several problems working together to make life miserable for you. Get the ASPI layer working first, and then check for DMA mode. Since your drive is only 4X, don't expect miracles for speed, but you should be able to get at least 2X out of it.

brickie and joeyvaz, please don't take this wrong, but this thread is not really concerned with hardware troubleshooting, but rather with ripping procedures, so once you guys have gotten things up and running, if you have no objection I would like to delete your posts (just the hardware oriented ones) in order to clean up the thread. Thanks.

[brickie]

no problem at all bob..just wasn't sure idf this needed another thread or not..you may go ahead and delete mine pertaining to my hardware problem asap...hopefully my new sony will solve that...

brickie

[rogo]

I think Bob's preference for SmartRipper is related to his preference for Movie Only.

I want to have all the goodies with the DVD; the idea being to have my whole collection -- in its entirety -- on the hard drives.

For this reason, I use DVD Decrypter in .ISO mode. The "pain" of the virtual drives and Daemon Tools is really quite minimal. And an ISO file >>is<< the DVD for all intents and purposes.

[Bob Sorel]

I think Bob's preference for SmartRipper is related to his preference for Movie Only.

I think you have that a bit backwards, Rogo. :)

Since you prefer to use ISO mode, you would have a preference of DVDD over SR, as it is the only one which rips in the ISO mode. Since I rip in the all files mode, and all three rippers discussed can do that, then that ability would have no influence over my decision. I merely prefer SR because it has the best proven track record for reliability in my experience.

[joeyvaz]

Not a problem Bob. You can go ahead delete my posts pertaining to hardware as well. I got Force to run and I was able to rip a movie with no problems. And the line you suggested I look at is fine as well. Thanks for the help.

-Joey

[Sherbona]

-------------
"Some files are still locked! Try to unlock them with a player." With the options to proceed being: Abort/Retry/Ignore

Any idea why this is happening?
-------------
I get this once in awhile. If you get a message like this when trying to rip, click Abort. Then start up WinDVD or PDVD (or whatever software DVD player that can play the disc with no problem). Pause the player if it starts playing the disc. Now that its 'unlocked', start SR again (with the player still on but 'paused') and SR should be able to rip without locked file issue.

[joeyvaz]

Hello again. I have all my software running properly now as decribed by Bob. I am ripping at a much higher rate than I initially could. The problem I am having now is when I go to view the movie I've ripped, DVD Starter launches PowerDVD (as I've set it up to do), but I get a message within PowerDVD that there is no disc present. Why is this happening?

BTW, I'm getting a green folder next to my ripped movie, not a diamond as described by Bob. Is that OK?

[Bob Sorel]

DVD Starter launches PowerDVD (as I've set it up to do), but I get a message within PowerDVD that there is no disc present. Why is this happening?

My guess is that you are in the DVD mode, and you need to be in the "Open DVD File on hard drive" mode instead, or you do not have DVDStarter set up properly as per my instructions previously. Please refer to Ripping 101 for a step by step guide to setting up DVDStarter.


BTW, I'm getting a green folder next to my ripped movie, not a diamond as described by Bob. Is that OK?

Yup, that's fine. :) Since I originally wrote Ripping 101, DVDStarter has changed its icons from diamonds to folders in its newer builds.

[joeyvaz]

Bob, sorry for all the questions, but you have been a great help so.

How do I change from DVD to "Open DVD on HD" mode? Is this a setting in PowerDVD or Smart Ripper? I've checked both and can't seem to find it.

THanks again,
Joe

[Bob Sorel]

Joe, on the PowerDVD control panel, just click on the button just to the left of the transport controls and it will open a requestor giving you all of the available choices for playback.

If you are launching from DVDStarter, then you don't need to open the files that way as DVDStarter creates a virtual drive that looks like a DVD drive to PowerDVD. Did you read my procedure in Ripping 101?

[Tracie]

Thought of one other issue that should be addressed in your guide. Some DVDs come with (for example) a choice of endings or viewing format (widescreen or NTSC). 2 that I have trouble with are - T2, Ultimate Edition (has alternate ending) & Disney's The Emperor's New Groove (offers choice of format). I personally don't know how to get around this because when I rip one of these movies, there is only 1 set of movie files. I bring it up because there must be someone out there that knows how to separate the 2 movies (I sure don't) & surely this should be addressed.

[Craig Woodhall]

great thread guys, very informative..

quick question. i ripped one of my movies in ISO mode with DVD decryptor. now i have an iso image on my PC that i want to change into ifo format to run off my HD using MYhtpc. can i convert it from ISO without re-ripping it?

Craig

[Tracie]

*I believe* that you'll need to mount the iso using Daemon Tools, then use either DVD Decrypter or Smartripper to change it to ifo. I can't think of any other way to do it, & it won't take that long or be that hard.

[Mary H]

Originally posted by Bob Sorel
If you are launching from DVDStarter, then you don't need to open the files that way as DVDStarter creates a virtual drive that looks like a DVD drive to PowerDVD. Did you read my procedure in Ripping 101?
I've been using DVDStarter successfully for months with TheaterTek. I'm trying to set up a new computer to use it with PowerDVD 4 XP. I've searched the Ripping 101 thread, and I see your procedure for setting up DVDStarter, which is the same way I've done it.

For some reason, though, I can't get it to work with PowerDVD. The DVD movie's folder is successfully mapped to X:\, which is what I defined in DVDStarter, but PowerDVD just comes up with a message that there's no disc in drive F:\ (the actual physical DVD-rom drive). Am I missing some crucial step here? Has anyone actually used DVDStarter successfully with PowerDVD 4?

[Bob Sorel]

For some reason, though, I can't get it to work with PowerDVD.

Hmmm....Same here. It works fine with TheaterTek and WinDVD, but I never tried PowerDVD. I just tried it out and I got the same results as you. You can still use PowerDVD by launching the program, clicking on the large button to the left of the navigation controls and select "Open DVD File on Hard Disc Drive" and then navigating to your ripped folder. Select VIDEO_TS.IFO from the available files and the set will play properly.

If anyone knows how to use DVDStarter with PowerDVD, please post here to inform the rest of us.

i ripped one of my movies in ISO mode with DVD decryptor. now i have an iso image on my PC that i want to change into ifo format to run off my HD using MYhtpc. can i convert it from ISO without re-ripping it?

I don't use ISOs, but I believe that Tracie is correct also. Give it a try - you won't hurt the ISO image.

Thought of one other issue that should be addressed in your guide. Some DVDs come with (for example) a choice of endings or viewing format (widescreen or NTSC). 2 that I have trouble with are - T2, Ultimate Edition (has alternate ending) & Disney's The Emperor's New Groove (offers choice of format). I personally don't know how to get around this because when I rip one of these movies, there is only 1 set of movie files.

Ok, I had both titles handy, so I ripped them just to see what the problem is. My copy of The Emperor's New Groove is the Ultimate Edition, and unfortunately has only the 16:9 version. I did take a look at T2 UE, though, and after loading it into DVDShrink, I opened a reauthor window and dragged the main movie into the new window. I now see three large titles and three 1 mb titles. You need to figure out which title you want and then just delete the others. In this case I just played the rip using PowerDVD (with "show information" checked), or I could have used IfoEdit's built in player, to navigate through the menus, intros, etc., then I chose "play extended version", and once I finally got to the movie, I made note of which title was playing. That is the title that you want to keep.

If you follow the same procedure with The Emperor's New Groove, you should discover a very similar situation, with two main titles about the same size. Navigate to the one you want to keep and then use DVDShrink to reauthor, keeping just the version you want .

[Craig Woodhall]

Tracie/Bob,

thanks guys, mounting the iso with Daemon then DvdShrink worked perfect. thanks again.

Craig

[Tracie]

Bob, thanks for the tip (don't know why I couldn't figure that one out, but oh well). Anyway, it worked just like you said on T2, but the Disney films that have both Widescreen & Fullscreen formats on the same disc just show up as 1 title in Shrink. Doesn't seem to be a big deal though, as I've been able to rip both Emperor's New Groove & Monsters, Inc. this way & both seem to work fine.

[brickie]

tracie how do you like the quality of your dvd shrink rips?theres been a little discussion as to wether or not the compression created a problem...to me,it does not..and i view on a crt and they look fabulous.

brickie

[Tracie]

brickie,
I don't use any compression at all on my rips, but do strip out all but one audio track & 1 set of subtitles. I just leave the files on the hard drive & play them from there & they look as good as the DVD on my HDTV (as they should). I'd be curious about that though, but nothing more since I don't have a DVD burner. :(

[Craig Woodhall]

yes, i just watched a movie that i used DvdShrink to put on my HD. on my 100" screen using my Barco 800, it is exactly the same as DVD. I ripped with 'no compression' and it looks great. the sound was perfect as well.

Craig

[maneuen]

Thanks again for all of you helpful tips. I've been using smartripper and ifoedit for a couple of months thanks to the ripping 101 thread.

I just recently ran into a problem. I am backing up a certain sequal that just came out (leaving out names...just in case). Using Smartripper, I get a broken block error and it stops ripping. The DVD plays fine in both the DVD player and pc, so what is causing this error and is there a way to get around it?

Like I've said, I only used SR so I could use Dvd decoder(?) if that would solve the problem?

Any suggestions

Thanks

[Tracie]

maneuen,
I'd try a different ripper, namely DVD Decrypter. If ripping in File Mode doesn't work, you could try ripping it as an ISO & then do what Craig did & mount the image with Daemon Tools & rip the files that way. I've heard that with damaged discs that can sometimes be a workaround solution.

[Bob Sorel]

I just recently ran into a problem. I am backing up a certain sequal that just came out (leaving out names...just in case). Using Smartripper, I get a broken block error and it stops ripping. The DVD plays fine in both the DVD player and pc, so what is causing this error and is there a way to get around it?

Yes, certainly try another ripper. The few times that I have run into these types of problems, though, NONE of the other rippers (including the famous VStrip) would successfully read the disc, but you owe it to yourself to give it a try.

I had much greater success with scratched and/or blemished discs by copying the files from the disc into a directory using Total Commander, my Windows shell of choice. TC is very persistent in reading the file, so if it does not read them, then nothing will. Once the files are copied to the hard drive, then you can use SR to remove the decryption. This is one of the reasons that I mentioned that rippers should be capable of ripping from the hard drive, though Lightning UK apparrantly disagrees.

I have been begging people over at Doom 9 to provide me with even one title that DVDD could rip that SR could not, and so far no one has come up with that one title. I understand, however, that if you rip out of region discs, then SR will fail and DVDD will succeed, but since I don't even know how to get my hands on out of region discs, I can't verify this one way or the other. For those of you can get such discs, please keep this in mind.

Maneuen, if you succeed using DVDD on "that certain sequel", and it is region 1, then please let me know the title so that I can try it out for myself. I have been trying really hard to find something that SR can not rip, but all of my leads have turned out to be dead ends.

I ripped with 'no compression' and it looks great. the sound was perfect as well.

Yes, when you rip with no compression, you get a bit for bit perfect copy, and thus is identical in video and audio quality to the original. When you compress the video, that is where you can run into less than optimal results. We will discuss this in more depth later.

Right now I just hope that everything is ok with Schud, as I haven't heard from him, he hasn't posted in this thread in a few days, and we are all eagerly awaiting his DVDShrink tutorial.

[schud]

Originally posted by Bob Sorel
Right now I just hope that everything is ok with Schud, as I haven't heard from him, he hasn't posted in this thread in a few days, and we are all eagerly awaiting his DVDShrink tutorial.

Sorry all, I've had a very busy week at work (out of town 3 days last week). I just haven't been able to get back to this project since last weekend.

Hopefully, when I get something done, it will be something that will answer lots of newbie type questions about DVD Shrink and ripping in general.

[Rgb]

Originally posted by Bob Sorel

BTW, if any of you programming types out there want to help, might I suggest writing a script to automate part of the drudgery involved in using IfoEdit to remove RCE protection and PUOs. For this procedure, all the IFOs in a set must be opened one at a time, and when the IFO is open, the user must hit the "region free" button (and answer the resultant requestors, which vary in number depending on what IfoEdit finds), hit the "remove P-UPs" button (and confirm), and then save the IFO twice, once as an IFO and then again as a BUP. Once the user has done this to every IFO in the set, then the user must open any IFO and hit the "Get VTS sectors" button (no saving required, but can require confirmation from 0 to x, where x = the number of IFOs in the set). Pretty simple task, but very boring, especially if the set has a lot of IFOs in it.

Ok, now, David, where is that DVDShrink procedure I know you've been working on? :D

The real question is- why don't DVD Decrypter and/or Smartripper simply do the IFOedit procedure as part of their rip process- simply executing IFOedit type routines after a good basic rip, compiled as part of their ripping process subroutines?

[Bob Sorel]

The real question is- why don't DVD Decrypter and/or Smartripper simply do the IFOedit procedure as part of their rip process- simply executing IFOedit type routines after a good basic rip, compiled as part of their ripping process subroutines?

Actually both DVDD and DVDShrink do just that. The problem is that those routines are done internally and are for some reason (unknown to me) not as dependable as IfoEdit's routines. As already mentioned, I had problems with subtitles left on by default when I used DVDD's PUO removal, but when I turned the PUO removal off in DVDD and used IfoEdit to remove the PUOs, then the subtitles were left off by default, which is the way it should be. There are plenty of reports from people having the same or similar issues with "built-in" PUO (and RCE) removal, while IfoEdit always seems to do it right. So until these issues are fixed, then "old reliable", despite some of its drudgery, still works best.

[brickie]

hey guys, is nero 6 ultra edition considered stable for burning.ive read that nero 5.5 is the last version of nero that actually is stable for burning dvds..anyone want to verify this?

brickie

[schud]

I'm using 5.5, so I know it works. Can't say about 6, because there's nothing in 6 that I need!

[zewt]

I have a Memorex dual Format DVD and using SmartRipper the fastest speed I can rip at is 2x.

Is this normal, or should it be higher? Is it a limitation of the software or something else.

I am fairly sure I have the drive functioning correctly in DMA.

Running Win 2k.

Is there some setting I need to check to determine if I have the drive IO configuration correct?

Any help/tips appreciated, as usual. :)

[Bob Sorel]

Zewt, this problem has been addressed earlier in this thread. Please read joeyvaz and my posts, and then if you still have problems let me know.

[zewt]

I did read those, but the solutions all seemed addressed to XP, and thus did not tranfer to Win 2K. Or at least nothing I could discover. I will re-read them and see if I over-looked something.

[Bob Sorel]

Ah, gotcha, Zewt. Maybe I should read a little more carefully. :)

Unfortunately I have never used Win 2000, so I can't help you. The only OSs I have run are Win 95, 98, and XP. Hopefully someone else can give you some help with your problem. Sorry...

[zewt]

I have downloaded the fireware patch, will give that a try.

I run all operating systems generally(have about 7 systems), except ME, but cannot seem to find anywhere in Win2K to change that BIOS to recognize the Ultra DMA.

But I also thought to get that full Ultra response you also needed to use an 80pin IDE cable, and my DVD did not come with that cable. I have some 80pin cables but have not tried it - yet.

Thanks for all the great information. I suspect many people are not getting the advertised speeds from their IDE devices unfortunately.

[Diode1]

Originally posted by brickie
hey guys, is nero 6 ultra edition considered stable for burning.ive read that nero 5.5 is the last version of nero that actually is stable for burning dvds..anyone want to verify this?
brickie
brickie,
I have burned well over 75 disc's using ultra 6 without problems.
-Jerry

[Mary H]

Originally posted by zewt
I have downloaded the fireware patch, will give that a try.

I run all operating systems generally(have about 7 systems), except ME, but cannot seem to find anywhere in Win2K to change that BIOS to recognize the Ultra DMA.

But I also thought to get that full Ultra response you also needed to use an 80pin IDE cable, and my DVD did not come with that cable. I have some 80pin cables but have not tried it - yet.

Thanks for all the great information. I suspect many people are not getting the advertised speeds from their IDE devices unfortunately. Apologies in advance if you already know this:

In Win2K, go into Control Panel --> System --> Hardware Device Manager --> IDE ATA/ATAPI Controllers. Go into the properties for both Primary and Secondary Channels, click on the Advanced Settings tab. Set each device to 'DMA if Available' Restart.

[zewt]

Well applied the Firmware patch, and the drive is recognized as Ultra DMA in IDE configuration, but still rips at 2x. Boo. :confused:

[mshan]

Can anyone explain what the difference between File, IFO, and ISO mode is during DVD ripping? What are the advantages and disadvantages of each for hard drive based DVD playback? (I currently have PowerDVD4 and XLobby 2.0 / Zoom Player basic for playback of ripped files)

Also, what does an MDS file do in an ISO file? What about the .ifo and .bup files with a File file?

Also, what are RCE protection, RC protection, and PUO and should they be removed before ripping a DVD? If so, why?

[K-Wood]

What are the pros/cons of ripping straight to a network drive using DVDShrink (or any other ripper, for that matter)?

Thanks,
Ken

[salsbst]

For DVDDecrypter, the con is that it crashes trying to rip to my Samba file server.

EDIT: Nevermind, I was thinking of EAC.

[schud]

Originally posted by K-Wood
What are the pros/cons of ripping straight to a network drive using DVDShrink (or any other ripper, for that matter)?

Thanks,
Ken

No cons that I know of. I do it regularly, and have no problems playing my server based DVD's with TheaterTek.

There is the opinion that copying your full DVD to your HDD in file or ISO mode saves wear and tear on your DVD drive. Copying all files is faster than using Shrink, and may save wear and tear by not spinning the DVD drive up and down as frequently. YMMV.

[brickie]

actually i use to rip all my movie sto play them straight from harddrive,and sometimes i still do.but another forum member brought up a valid point..that replacing a dvdrom drive is alot cheaper than replacing a harddrive that has failed...now i'm not saying playing movies from the hear drive will cause premature failure,especially no more than playing from a dvdrom.but once again one is much cheaper to relace than the other..

brickie

actually having thought a little about that. har drives are so cheap now this point might be moot..

[brickie]

got another question,sort of to schud...how important is the deep analysis when using dvd shrink?do you do it all the time?is there a reference for when it is important?animation,slow mo,action, etc?any opinions appreciated..

brickie

[BrianH33]

You only need to deep analysis if your are compressing the movie so more. If you use No Compression then this option is useless ie do not use it.

Got this from the DVDShrink forums.....

[jplumey]

Thanks guys, for this great thread. I started backing up my titles last night and so far I have 5 backups with the movie and subtitles only. Each of my rips takes about 6 Gb as I am not using any compression. I performed the rips with DVDShrink. It's a great program!

Thanks again!

[rbmcgee]

DVD ripping speed seems to receive a lot questions and some confusion seems to exist. Let me try to offer some clarity.

DVD ripping speed is limited by 3 factors:

1) The DVD itself. Certain movies rip faster, some slower. Some disk-types rip faster (DVD-5) and some slower (DVD-9). Some disks rip faster (no macrovision) and some slower (macrovision). Obviously macrovision is present on most commercial DVDs, ie, movies. There is nothing that can be done about these variances.

2) The speed of the DVD-ROM drive. This takes 2 forms. The first is the inherent speed of the drive, ie, 16x read and the second is whether the drive has a firmware restriction, limiting the read speed, usually to 2x, when macrovision is present. There is nothing that can be done about the inherent speed of the drive except to buy a new drive. The firmware restriction however, in some cases, can be eliminated. The way to accomplish this is to install new firmware. To learn whether there is a ‘firmware hack’ for your drive and to download that hack, go here: http://forum.firmware-flash.com/dl_all.php . There is also a forum and a nice little program called DiscInfo that can provide info about your current drive. If your drive can be hacked, and you hack it, the speed limit restriction will be removed. If you are considering a new drive anyway and will be concerned about ripping speed, you might want to check out this page to see if your planned new drive has a hack.

3) The third, and most difficult to understand is the WinXP speed limit restriction. This has to do with DMA settings and a WinXP “feature/bug”. Basically, in order to protect the drive, even if you have DMA set on your machine, once you start ripping (or maybe rip a few movies) WinXP will shut off your DMA setting and put you into PIO mode. Obviously, this significantly restricts your ability to get speed. To understand the issue, please read these two threads from Doom9. http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=43748 and http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=43758&perpage=20&pagenumber=1 .

The way I get around this third issue is that I’ve installed Intel Application Accelerator (IAA). As I understand it, IAA forces the IDE controllers into DMA mode and then locks then there, preventing WinXP from switching into PIO mode. The debate regarding whether IAA is good or bad can be found here (at the asus forum) http://www.abxzone.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=28233&highlight=iaa .

My situation: I have the Toshiba 1612 drive. Before I did anything, I was getting a max speed of 2x. Then I updated the Toshiba’s firmware (hacked) and would temporarily get 4x-8x speeds, but would slow down to 2x before too long. I noticed that the IDE channel was now operating in PIO mode. I then learned about IAA and took a chance. Now I always get between 4x and 8x+ on my rips and have never been pushed into PIO mode.

NOTES:
- Once IAA is installed, you will no longer even see the ‘settings’ tab on your IDE channels.
- I’m using IAA 2.3 on an Intel D845PEBT2 board running WinXP w/ SP1 without a RAID setup and have not experienced any problems at all.

[brickie]

very informative post..i use to use IA,but after i reformatted i never installed it back..i may reinstall it,although i have no complaints on speed..in fact sometimes slower is better from my understanding..

brickie

[schud]

Great post, rbmcgee!

FWIW, I don't believe that the IAA is applicable to newer motherboards using the Intel 865\875 controller chipsets.

[brickie]

what about a board that uses the 845 chipset?want to share any SPECIFIC settings that should be set within IAA?

brickie

[zewt]

I have seen many DVD burners that say they have DVD-R and DVD+R, but I have no idea that the "+" and "-" represent?

[zewt]

I am assuming [COLOR=red]IAA[/COLOR] is only for Intal based systems, and not AMD?

[schud]

Originally posted by zewt
I have seen many DVD burners that say they have DVD-R and DVD+R, but I have no idea that the "+" and "-" represent?

http://www.dvddemystified.com/dvdfaq.html

[rbmcgee]

brickie,

There are no settings in IAA. You simply install, reboot and then you've got IAA. It's not a program, it's more of a driver.

zewt,

I don't know if IAA would work on an AMD board or not. The Asus board is the place to find the answer though, if nobody here knows.

[rbmcgee]

brickie,

One more thing, I would definately create a system restore point before installing IAA and maybe even a Ghost image.

[schud]

Originally posted by zewt
I am assuming [COLOR=red]IAA[/COLOR] is only for Intal based systems, and not AMD?

That is correct. Intel chipsets only.

[brickie]

a restore point i could do...a ghost image,not..i don't have the softwar efor it..i may just go ahead and leave this one alone..like i said i installe dit once to cure a problem i was having,but it's been so long i don't even remember what for..like i said,i'm satisfied with my burn and read speed...and my dvd playvack is flawless so that's enough.i think i will adopt the "if it ain't broke,don't fix it" attitude..

the only thing that amazes me is the quality of the media..i bought a pack of 25 blank dvd-r's from circuit city...off brand name.shows as tdk's in dvdinfo though..but iv'e already seen 3 bad ones in the pack...they wouldn't even be recognized in my burner..they were at the top of pack by the way,or spindle.after them everything has been fine.go figure...generic name was khypermedia by the way.

brickie

[zewt]

So...


There are six recordable versions of DVD: DVD-R for General, DVD-R for Authoring, DVD-RAM, DVD-RW, DVD+RW, and DVD+R. DVD-R and DVD+R can record data once, like CD-R, whereas DVD-RAM, DVD-RW, and DVD+RW can be rewritten thousands of times, like CD-RW. DVD-R was first available in fall 1997. DVD-RAM followed in summer 1998. DVD-RW came out in Japan in December 1999, but was not available in the U.S. until spring 2001. DVD+RW became available in fall 2001. DVD+R was released in mid 2002.

DVD-RAM is more of a removable storage device for computers than a video recording format, although it has become widely used in DVD video recorders because of the flexibility it provides in editing a recording. The other two recordable format families (DVD-R/RW and DVD+R/RW) are essentially in competition with each other. The market will determine which of them succeeds or if they end up coexisting or merging. There are many claims that one or the other format is better, but they are actually very similar. In 2003 many companies began making drives that could record in both "dash" and "plus" format.

[zewt]

Well finally found the correct firmware for my Memorex, (it is essentially a Pioneer).

Was only able to rip at 2x before patching using SmartRipper.

After patching the firmware I am seeing speeds up to 12X, averaging about 8X.

Much Much Nicer then 2X. :)

[brickie]

you know , i assumed we were talking about burning speed...should have read more carefully..i never actually paid attention to what my rip speed is in dvddecryptor..i'll have to check.

brickie

[zewt]

I have yet to test Burn Speed, in the past I was getting about 4X, I doubt it will be much faster. I also use Smart Ripper, (DVD decrypter on occasion) for ripping.

[brickie]

i know burn speed is very dependant on firmware and media type...if i remember i was getting 4x with some imations...with these off brands iv'e been getting 2x but i guess that's cool since that is what they're rated for..i burn strictly from dvddecryptor!!!so i really don't remember if you can burn faster with it..

brickie

[Tracie]

Another issue that I have inconsistent success with is subtitles in movies that you need them, i.e. LOTR (when they're speaking Elvish) & Dances With Wolves (when they're speaking Sioux). The LOTR movies I have no trouble with - the subtitle stay & work perfectly. But Dances With Wolves I can't get them to stay at all, & that's a movie that you can't do without them. (Another are Star Wars Episodes 1 & 2 when they're speaking with Watto - no workie.) Anyone have any tips on this (Schud, Bob?)? They work with just a standard all-file rip with DVD Decrypter, but if I try to strip anything out (menus, audio tracks, but leaving the English subtitle track) using Shrink, they disappear.

[Mary H]

I've seen a lot of discussion about the LOTR elvish issue, and other subtitle problems, in the DVD Shrink forum: http://forum.digital-digest.com/forumdisplay.php?forumid=48

[brickie]

looking more into nero 6...i see they have a recode "option now available.has anybody downloaded and played with this?it seems to look interesting..i know it does exactly what shrink does..but just wondering if maybe it does it better?

brickie

[schud]

I think you will find that Nero Recode and DVDShrink are VERY similar ;) I believe they are siblings, although Mr. Shrink will not confirm that (however, to my knowledge, he has never denied it either)!

[schud]

Originally posted by Tracie
(Another are Star Wars Episodes 1 & 2 when they're speaking with Watto - no workie.) Anyone have any tips on this (Schud, Bob?)?

Hi Tracie:

Can you point to a specific chapter in either E1 or E2?

[brickie]

i admit that thought popped in my mind.there just seems to be alot of programs the do the dvd-9 to dvd-r encoding...well i'm going to go ahead and give nero a shot..i will leave everything else up to shrink..it's been so awesome,why take chances or switch.

brickie

[brickie]

well made a couple of back-ups with nero 6 and they play fine in everything!!!looks like for awhile i won't have to use imgtools to make a img file before burning..although the img file creation is very fast thru img tools..

also on another note..i bought a 5 pk of tdk 2x dvd-r media to try out..when i opened first thing i noticed was how deep the purple dye was..i hear this is good..when i checked in dvdinfo they were actually 4x riteks..go figure..they burn flawless and at 4x as dvd info stated!!man,i wish i would have bought more of these as they were on sale for $5.49.

brickie

[Tracie]

Can you point to a specific chapter in either E1 or E2?

Schud,

Thanks for the response & sorry I haven't been able to get back to you sooner. The one that I was thinking of was the scene in Episode 1 when Qui-Gon first goes to Watto's shop & meets Anakin for the first time (chapter 14). At the beginning & again at the end of the scene inside the shop there is some dialog between Watto & Anakin in a different language (Tatooineise ? :) ) that has subtitles originally but aren't there after DVD Shrink processing. (There is some further dialog between Sebulba & Anakin at the beginning of chapter 15 as well.) I'm sure that there's more, but those were the spots that I was sure about & had time to check. I can also think of a spot in Episode 2, but am not sure if there are subtitles originally. It's where Anakin & Padme go back to Tatooine to rescue his mother & they meet with Watto right after arriving (don't know the chapter off the top of my head).

Anyway, thanks for the help. Let me know if there's any more info that I can provide. I'm also going to take Mary's advice & check out Dr. Shrink's forums for additional help. If I come up with a solution, I'll post it.

[windtrader]

Hi Bob and Schud,

Great to see you are now at 102 and maintaining a knowledge feed from Doom9. At the risk of being pelted with coasters from all you Shrinksters, I would like to mention a problem in the current version of shrink that I do not see mentioned.

The re-author feature has a bug that does not handle the proper internal "clip" points. It occurs when using the reauthor chapter point and the start-end features. This is a benign problem for all users who just want to select parts of the movie and copy them off or join them together as a composite.

You will have problems if you plan to take the clipped video back into a video editor such as Ulead MediaStudio, Adobe Premiere or even do some title authoring with something like DVD Author, DVD Producer, or DVD-Lab etc.,

The specific problem is the program does not handle clipping properly and the GOPS are cut off in the middle and the resultant file does not adhere to the standard GOP IBP frame structure. Couple things happen: either the editing program just can't accept the file at all or it will take it in but there will be an audio out of synch problem.

Since this thread has always tried to ensure a high integrity of the backups (the DVDD vs SR saga for example), I feel it is important that you two make sure users are aware of this defect and do not get screwed down the road. It is not fatal but does require a fair bit of manual processing to restore the shrink produced back into standard mpeg format.

IMHO this defect is far more insidious than the DVDD/SR issue that gets lots of airtime.

Thanks

[schud]

Hi Windtrader,

Thanks for the excellent post! That's really good information, very clearly stated, for anyone who plans to reauthor DVD's via another program. Since most all of my experience with DVDShrink is derived from stripping out menus and such, for storage and playback from my media server, or from making movie only backups to DVD+R, I would never have known that. I also like to create my own demo clip discs using Shrink, but do not use menus and such.

However, for anyone who wants or plans to reauthor DVD's using Shrinks editing feature with menus and such, your advice is invaluable.

Thanks for Sharing! :)

[brickie]

just saw there's a program called autoshrink,was wondering if anyone is using it?it seems to be essentially a automated program that rips and reencodes via shrink,then creates the iso and then burns it with dvddecryptor all with one click..seems interesting..i was doing this exact same thing using a few seperate programs before i discovered nero 6 about a week ago..

brickie

[Craig Woodhall]

another question about DVDshrink..

i backed up a bunch of my movies to my HD. after seeing how much space the rolling credits at the end of the movies take up, i want to go back and do the start/stop thing and delete the ends off all my movies to save HD space. do i have to re-author all these movies all over again?

Craig

ps. i just went through and re-authored all of them anyways!

[roscoe62]

I've got a question.

Waay back on page 1 of this thread, Tracie mentioned a way to join 2 disc movies together using DVDShrink.

For the life of me I CANNOT get this to work. After placing the first disc's files into the re-author window, when I open the second disc and go to re-author, the first disc's files are gone.

Could someone please help a DVDShrink newbie to get this to work?

I've already ripped the entire 2 discs to my HD, and I've already gone back over each of them to strip out all but 1 audio & subtitle track. All I need to do now is join them.

Anyone?

Ross

[Craig Woodhall]

Ross,

i am just coming across the same problem.. i think what the problem is, is I was using DVDshrink 2.3, when i went to 3.0 beta 5, it seemed to work. i am in the process of re-authoring Fellowship of the Ring. if you haven't upgraded, i would suggest downloading the latest version.

Craig

[ddlooping]

roscoe62, as Craif suggested, you will need v3.0 beta 5 to make your compilation.
I was going to post links to guides but I'm not allowed yet, so please use the link in my signature.
If you're not familiar with v3.0 beta 5, first view the "Basic Re-authoring" guide, then the "advanced" one which deals with compilations. ;)

[ddlooping]

Craig , another good way of saving space without cutting the end-credits (which often have a soundtrack that "carries" the mood of the movie), is to apply "Still-pictures" to them (the playback would be seamless).

The guide is called "Applying various compression levels to one title".
This makes use of a DVD Shrink very powerful feature, which allow different degrees of compression to be applied to any part(s) of any title(s).
Handy if there are demanding scenes you want to apply less (or no) compression to. ;)

[Tracie]

Ross,
The only one that I tried it with is the 3.0 beta 5, but I have read that it's hit & miss with the older versions. Like Craig & ddlooping said, if you're using 2.3 that's probably it.

[SCM]

I've been following this thread loosely, but this is my first post on the subject. I've ripped several of my DVDs to HD using Shrink 3.0. I am storing them on a file server away from my HTPC. When I play back the rips, I am getting pauses in playback that last 2-3 seconds, then everything continues w/o problem. There doesn't appear to be any pattern to the pauses, and if I rewind and play again, I don't get a pause in the same spot. I play back on TheaterTek.

Does this sound like a rip problem or a network problem? Are others having this type of problem with Shrink rips?

Thanks.
Steve

[schud]

Hi ddlooping!

Thanks for stopping by, and welcome to the AVS forum.

ddlooping is the moderator of the DVDShrink forum over at digital digest and a regular contributor to the doom9 "one click backup solutions" forum as well.

He's also written some helpful guides on his own site: do check out the links in his signature.

[ddlooping]

Thanks for the welcome, schud, I appreciate it. :)

[Tracie]

There doesn't appear to be any pattern to the pauses, and if I rewind and play again, I don't get a pause in the same spot.

That doesn't sound like a ripping problem to me. Could be a network problem, but more likely something isn't set up correctly in your software. I'd do a search on the subject both here and over on the TheaterTek forums on the subject & if you don't find your answer that way, post a thread on the topic. I think you'll find that it's a relatively common problem.

EDIT: The first thing I'd try, though, is a different ripper like DVD Decrypter or Smartripper.

[schud]

Originally posted by SCM
When I play back the rips, I am getting pauses in playback that last 2-3 seconds, then everything continues w/o problem. There doesn't appear to be any pattern to the pauses, and if I rewind and play again, I don't get a pause in the same spot. I play back on TheaterTek.

Does this sound like a rip problem or a network problem? Are others having this type of problem with Shrink rips?

Thanks.
Steve

Hi SCM,

I have a terrabyte media server with well over 125 movies, all backed up with a combination of DVD Decrypter and DVDShrink. I'm using MainLobby\DVDLobby as a front end and TheaterTek for DVD playback. It works flawlessly for me.

Perfect HTPC based DVD playback seems to be so particular to a users specific hardware and software, that it is always difficult to know what the exact problem might be. You know, hardware, network, video drivers, audio drivers, OS, etc. :confused:

All I can say for sure is that I don't share your problem. Perhaps more information about your hardware and software configuration might help someone spot a specific, known issue.

[SCM]

Thanks for the feedback.

I have a P4 1.8 HTPC and a PIII 450MH server, both running XP-Pro. My network runs through a Linksys router/802.11b wireless access point. The server and the HTPC are connected through cat5e and are running at 100bps.


I use myHTPC as a front end and TT 1.5 for playback. I don't have any problems with direct DVD playback. My best guess is that this is a network problem, so I am going to move a movie off the server to a local drive on the HTPC and see if I still get the problem. If I do, then I know it is a software set-up/rip problem. If I don't, then I know that I have a network probem. We will see. But, you guys have confirmed that this is not a normal problem that people are having with Shrink, so that helps much.

[JDLIVE]

Just wanted to thank Bob for the great info here and the recommendation of Smartripper. I had been having no luck getting disc 2 of FOTR-EE ripped with other tools, and even SR seemed to hang at the same spot. Finally I decided to let SR "finish" instead of killing it when it seemed to hang, and it finally did get through! ;) Now I can get to work on TTT-EE.... ;)

[roscoe62]

Thanks Craig, ddlooping & Tracie,

That's what the problem was OK. I'm still using DVDShrink 2.3. I'll check out v3 beta!

Cheers!

Ross

[ddlooping]

"Thanks Craig, ddlooping & Tracie..."
You're welcome. :)

[shunx]

I have a question (and sorry if I missed an answer from earlier):
is there a way to easily re-author a disk with everything (menus, extras) intact except a couple minor changes like removing the previews that come before the main movie? I tried the re-author option in DVD Shrink by copying the movie over but it screwed up the structure of the original disk.

[ddlooping]

"...is there a way to easily re-author a disk with everything (menus, extras) ..."

shunx, I think you can do it with CloneDVD and/or Nero Recode if the parts you want to remove have their own titleset. ;)

[Bob Sorel]

Hello, everyone,

I'm sorry I haven't gotten back here sooner, but it hasn't been by choice.

First of all, I would also like to welcome ddlooping to the forum. He is a very knowledgeable person (especially concerning his favorite program, DVDShrink) who contributes greatly and helps out everyone he can. He is a real asset to any forum and I hope he sees fit to continue spending time around here.

Ok, to address some earlier questions, some of which have been answered, but I'll throw my 2 cents in anyway: :)

Since this thread has always tried to ensure a high integrity of the backups (the DVDD vs SR saga for example), I feel it is important that you two make sure users are aware of this defect and do not get screwed down the road. It is not fatal but does require a fair bit of manual processing to restore the shrink produced back into standard mpeg format.

Thanks, Don, I was not aware of the problem, but I will keep it in mind should I ever have the need to process Shrink files in another program. When DVDShrink 3.0 final is released, please keep us updated on this issue.

I have yet to test Burn Speed, in the past I was getting about 4X, I doubt it will be much faster

Burn speed is pretty much capped at the rating of the burner, and none of the solutions presented will change that. The hacked firmware and use of DMA mode will only affect ripping speed.

when i checked in dvdinfo they were actually 4x riteks..go figure..they burn flawless and at 4x as dvd info stated!!man,i wish i would have bought more of these as they were on sale for $5.49.

Ritek makes some of the best DVD-R media in the business, so it is no surprise that these discs burn just fine.

As far as low priced media is concerned, I have had great luck with the printable DVD Pro DVD-R media (rated at 1X, but they burn fine at 2X in my Pioneer DVR-104 burner (with hacked firmware). They only cost about $.80 each in quantity and have been very reliable so far. Remember that regardless of what brand of media you buy, you can always get "bad" batches and "good" batches, and at this point in the manufacturing process, the consistency between batches has not been as good as it should be. Things keep getting better as manufacturing processes evolve, so I wouldn't worry too much about buying most any brand or generic media as time goes on.

The one that I was thinking of was the scene in Episode 1 when Qui-Gon first goes to Watto's shop & meets Anakin for the first time (chapter 14). At the beginning & again at the end of the scene inside the shop there is some dialog between Watto & Anakin in a different language (Tatooineise ? ) that has subtitles originally but aren't there after DVD Shrink processing.

Hi Tracie,

I will also take a look at those chapters and run some experiments for you to see if I can figure this one out, though I won't have the time until next week. I will post my findings as soon as I can.

Waay back on page 1 of this thread, Tracie mentioned a way to join 2 disc movies together using DVDShrink.....[snip]....For the life of me I CANNOT get this to work. After placing the first disc's files into the re-author window, when I open the second disc and go to re-author, the first disc's files are gone.

I think this has already been answered, but just in case, this feature is only supported in version 3.0 beta x and not in version 2.3. Version 3.0 incorporates quite a few features not included in earlier versions, and until 3.0 (or whatever it will be) final is released, I strongly recommend sticking with 3.0 beta 5. It is very stable, and the only problem I am aware of is that beta 5 robs the .IFO association in Windows. Oops, yeah, and now the problem that Windtrader pointed out, though I don't think that will affect the vast majority of users.

roscoe62, as Craif suggested, you will need v3.0 beta 5 to make your compilation.

Yup, I was right...ddlooping was already there with the answer :)

I was going to post links to guides but I'm not allowed yet, so please use the link in my signature.

ddlooping, when everything is ready, please post links to your guides here. I am sure that everyone will benefit greatly from them.

When I play back the rips, I am getting pauses in playback that last 2-3 seconds, then everything continues w/o problem. There doesn't appear to be any pattern to the pauses, and if I rewind and play again, I don't get a pause in the same spot. I play back on TheaterTek.

This sounds like a network problem to me, or Windows is performing a lot of background tasks or services. Just to be sure, play the rip from a local hard drive - If it plays fine there, then your ripping process is sound and you can look for problems elsewhere. If there is a problem on the local drive, it may or may not be a ripping problem.

I don't have any problems with direct DVD playback. My best guess is that this is a network problem, so I am going to move a movie off the server to a local drive on the HTPC and see if I still get the problem.

That's what I get for being absent. You already figured out the correct troubleshooting procedure. :)

is there a way to easily re-author a disk with everything (menus, extras) intact except a couple minor changes like removing the previews that come before the main movie?

You can also do it with DVDStripper, but at this point in the program's development, I can not in good conscience recommend it. IfoEdit can do what you want, but the procedures are not as simple as those we have been working with so far.

[ddlooping]

Thanks for the welcome and compliments, Bob, I appreciate both. :)
ddlooping, when everything is ready, please post links to your guides here. I am sure that everyone will benefit greatly from them.
I have now more than 5 posts to my account, so here is the link:
http://www.dvdshrink.info/guides.php
If you think it'd be better to link to each guide separately (there are 10 of them), please let me know. ;)

[Tracie]

Hi Bob,
Glad to see that you're back. Thought I'd give you some more detailed info on the subtitles issue. Both Star Wars Episodes 1 & 2 do not have subtitles (in Episode 2 there are 2 spots that I can point you to - Chapter 27, dialog between Anakin & Watto; Chapter 40, Geonosian speaking at the beginning of the gladiator scene). Dances With Wolves Special Edition does not have subtitles either (I don't think I need to point out a spot in this one - they're all over). These are the titles that I actually went back & searched to be sure, were ripped using DVD Decrypter & they worked fine before processing with the Re-Author function in Shrink. The titles that I have that kept their subtitles after Shrink processing are The Godfather Part 2 (lots of Italian dialog in that one), & both LOTR EE movies.

No rush on this. I know that with the holidays coming, all of us are going to have less time to play with this hobby. Let me know if there is any more help that I can provide on my end.

[ddlooping]

Tracie, the problem you're having with subtitles is actually a DVD Shrink known issue.
It looks like dvdshrink, the developer, is having difficulties fixing it, but hopefully he will do so soon. :)

In the meantime, I'd suggest you do not strip any subtitles when one of them is essential to the understanding of the movie. ;)

[Tracie]

Right after I posted that I did a search over on the Shrink forum & came to that conclusion (doh!). The weird thing is that some titles keep the text, while others don't. :confused:

In the meantime, I'd suggest you do not strip any subtitles when one of them is essential to the understanding of the movie.

I'll give this a try. Thanks for the reply.

[ddlooping]

"I'll give this a try. Thanks for the reply."

Please let us know if this works.
You're welcome. :)

[Bob Sorel]

Tracie, in the meantime you can always reauthor using IfoEdit. I provided step by step instructions in the Ripping 101 thread on how to reduce the rip to "movie only", and as far as I can recall, IfoEdit does not suffer from this problem. I will check it out as soon as I can and get back to you.

[brickie]

yeah ,you missed it...you can use the start end feature of dvd shrink to do that.at least i believe you can.

brickie

[ddlooping]

you can use the start end feature of dvd shrink to do that. at least i believe you can.
Sorry if I missed something, brickie, but what are you refering to?

[brickie]

http://www.dvdshrink.info/re-author-advanced.php

was referring to this guide..i thought it could be done by the start/ end feature per the advanced reauthoring guide..sorry if this is incorrect.

brickie

[ddlooping]

"you can use the start end feature of dvd shrink to do that. at least i believe you can."
"i thought it could be done by the start/ end feature per the advanced reauthoring guide..."

Sorry if I appear obtuse, brickie, but I'm still not sure what it and that is. :confused:

[shunx]

I'm having problem using DVDStarter with WinDVD 5. It will not start movies at all. Anyone else has this problem?

[ddlooping]

Hi shunx. :)

I'm not sure if it is relevant to your problem, but I've found the following info:

"You'll need to edit the c:\windows\DVDSTARTER.INI if your version of WinDVD was not installed into the default directory."

I hope this helps. ;)

[brickie]

Originally posted by shunx
I have a question (and sorry if I missed an answer from earlier):
is there a way to easily re-author a disk with everything (menus, extras) intact except a couple minor changes like removing the previews that come before the main movie? I tried the re-author option in DVD Shrink by copying the movie over but it screwed up the structure of the original disk.

ddlooping, this was the thread that i was answering for....how in the heck i got confused ,don't ask me..it's been one of those days...yeah i can see now how,you're wondering what the heck i'm talking about..disregard,i think he got it answered anyway..

brickie

[ddlooping]

No problem, brickie, thanks for the clarification. :)

I just need to add that the menu(s) can not be kept when "re-authoring" with DVD Shrink.
Well, they actually can, but will not be functional and will play like a video stream. ;)

[brickie]

i didn't know that one..is that the case ddlooping if you "process" the entire dvd but just want to shrink it down to fit on a dvd-r..the menus won't work...i know the compression ratio would be terrible probably,but that would still be a nice feature...dvd xcopy does that with one click,right...just curious about that .

brickie

[ddlooping]

The menus will only lose their functionability if you use "Re-author" (when "dragged" to the "New DVD" pane they are treated as normal titles).

In full-disc mode (DVD Shrink default one), the structure of the original DVD is left intact, including fully functioning menus. :)

If the compression ratio is then too low (high compression) for the movie title, you have the option to manually lower the ratio for menus and/or extras, and even use "Still pictures" for the features you do not intend to watch (which reduces their sizes by about 85%).
If the movie-title is left on "automatic", manually lowering the other titles will make its ratio go up. ;)

[brickie]

how effective is the still setting?does it really help with compression to apply stills to say all of the end credits? this is something i knew was there,but just really never thought about using it...i will have to checkit out to see how it looks..

brickie

[ddlooping]

"Still pictures" reduces a title size by about 85%, so the space gained for other titles is proportional to the original title you apply it on.
I mostly do movie-only backup, and almost always apply "Still pictures" to the end-credits (it takes about 10-20 seconds to set-up).
It usually enables me to gain between 2 and 4% for the movie itself (depending on the lenght of the credits).

The following guide shows you how to seamlessly apply "Still pictures" to the end-credits (or any compression to any part of any title(s) in "Re-author" mode, for that matter). ;)
http://www.dvdshrink.info/mixed-compressions.php

[brickie]

sounds cool...i'm going to check it out,bu tdo you really feel the gain is worth the "effort",if yo uknow what i mean..?do you notice a difference in picture quality by doing this?

brickie

heading to link...

[brickie]

went and took a look at the tutorial,seems simple enough...just one more question before i get soem zzzz's,how ar ethe stills pics displayed?like rotating wallpaper every few seconds?if so can you control the time?

brickie

[ddlooping]

"Still pictures" look like a series of snapshots, one snapshot being taken every second.
Whether it's worth the effort or not depends very much on the level of compression applied to the movie-title.
If it requires a fair amount of compression ("Ratio" < 85-80%), I believe any gain can only have positive results (how noticeable depends on your eyesight and viewing equipment).
Also, when the overal compression is almost negligeable ("Ratio" > 95-98%), it's sometimes enough for the rest of the movie to require "No Compression", which makes a huge psychological difference as far as I'm concerned. :D

Once you get the hang of it, it only takes 10-20 seconds to set-up, so no real "effort" here. ;)

[shunx]

Originally posted by ddlooping
"You'll need to edit the c:\windows\DVDSTARTER.INI if your version of WinDVD was not installed into the default directory."

Thanks ddlooping. I did install it (version 2.3b) at the default directory, C:\Program Files\DVDStarter. And there's no DVDSTARTER.INI on the drive I think.

This is what happens: I click on a movie from the starter, and WinDVD starts, but it simply resumes what it was playing before instead of the movie I just chose. Or if WinDVD was not playing playing something before I used the starter, WinDVD would start and give the error message "No Valid Drive/Disc Found!"

So am I the only one having a problem with DVDStarter and WinDVD *5*?

[ddlooping]

Sorry shunx, I do not use DVDStarter (or even know what it is).
The info I gave you came from a Google search I made after having read your query.
In any case, the info states "DVDSTARTER.INI" should be in your "C:\Windows\" folder; did you have a look in there?
Also, the problem is said to occur when "WinDVD" was not installed in the default directory. ;)
But all this could have no connection to what you're experiencing.

[shunx]

it's ok ddlooping. DVDStarter was the recommended program from the Ripping 101 thread for starting ripped DVDs.

Can anyone recommend another front end, or does everyone play movies manually? At the moment I'm keeping files as ISOs and mounting them to play.

[shunx]

Originally posted by ddlooping
The menus will only lose their functionability if you use "Re-author" (when "dragged" to the "New DVD" pane they are treated as normal titles).

In full-disc mode (DVD Shrink default one), the structure of the original DVD is left intact, including fully functioning menus. :)

Editing (deleting titles) seems to be impossible under full-disc mode.

I tried CloneDVD like you said, but I couldn't find the options to cut scenes. Also it seems to be a lossy encoder. I'll try Nero Recode.

[Update: I tried Nero Recode to get rid of trailers before the main menu. Unfortunately all Recode does is putting in a still image in place of the trailers, for the whole duration of the trailers. It appears deleting content without changing the overall menu structure is not very easy.]

[Tracie]

Can anyone recommend another front end, or does everyone play movies manually?

shunx,
Theater Tek can do what you want if you want to switch players. Also, Xlobby works with ifo files. It has a cool feature of automatically mounting a virtual drive when you click "Play", yet you don't need .iso format or Daemon to make this work. Pretty slick.

[BrianH33]

I liked to report on backing up my movies to hard drives.

I have ripped about 70 movies (of my 270) so far. The problem is that I did not watch any of them till a couple of weeks ago. Started to watch one thru TT and it started to go into FF mode with 100% CPU and TT no longer responding. I said "that's weird .... better check the rest of them!"

So I did. I checked them by starting TT and using the chapter advance, went thru to the end of the movie.

Also, I started ripping with DVDShrink only. Then I found some movies it would not decrypt. Then started to use DVDecrypter. This seemed to be going good until the movie I discovered that was bad. so ...

50% of all movies ripped with DVDShrink failed.
20% of all movies ripped with DVDD and DVDShrink failed.

Over all 30% would not play or hung TT half way thru.

Then I re-ripped (still going on) all the movies that failed. I used Bob's method as posted in Ripping 101. Guess What! They are all working now.

That's right 0% failure with Smartripper and IFOEdit. Guess which method I am using from now on! :)

[zewt]

I have never had any trouble with SmartRipper and IFOedit. But only done about 50 movies.

[schud]

Originally posted by BrianH33

50% of all movies ripped with DVDShrink failed.
20% of all movies ripped with DVDD and DVDShrink failed.



That's interesting BrianH33. I have 110 Shrink based movies ripped on my HD, and they all play perfectly via TheaterTek, using DVDLobby as a front end to browse and launch the movies.

The way I rip and process is 1) I rip a full disc ISO image using DVD Decrypter to the HDD; 2) I mount the image in Daemon Tools; then 3) I then use DVDShrink to process the movie only with no or sometimes minimal compression.

There's been some previous discussion about the ISO\Daemon tools process, and that it's an unnecessary extra step in the process. I do agree that that's true. However, if I rip the entire original DVD ISO to the drive, then a) I know that I've got the entire, original DVD there, and b) I won't confuse it's files with another project's ripped files. Maybe it's silly and unnecessary. However, in the end, TheaterTek plays all of my movies just fine without exception. I then have the ISO to explore the trailers and extras, to see if there's anything extra worth keeping. If there is a problem, it's usually a problem with the original disc, and you will find that out when DVDD fails in mid rip with a "cannot read disc" cryptic type of error message. However, you will find that out using either ISO or files mode, I suppose.

I've also backed up a number of my DVDShrink based movies to DVD+R discs, and they all play fine on several set-top boxes I own too.

I don't think there's any argument that Bob's Smart Ripper\IFOEdit process is the most tested and reliable method that's been discussed in these threads. If you've got the time and patience, you can't go wrong.

I'm just too lazy! :D

[chris^sm]

I'm having a heck of a time getting the rips to play in theatertek - it just doesn't seem to want to play the vob file. I used bob's method of ripping, except for the ifoedit Movie only portion because I don't know how to do that. But I do use dvdshrink to get the Movie only, less menus etc. For example, the movie "the element after 4" plays fine in windvd, but theatertek won't open it. any suggestions?

thx

[schud]

chris^sm:

Are you patched up to the latest version of TheaterTek (ver 1.5.56)?

If yes, you should be able to launch the movie by clicking the video_ts.ifo file.

[Mary H]

I've used DVD Shrink 3.0 beta 5 on most of my movies, and i've had no problems being able to play any of them from the hard drive. They work equally well for me with TT's latest version + DVD Starter, PowerDVD, or Zoomplayer.

The only time I had problems with playing these movies after burning them to DVD-R disks was if i tried to use ultra-cheap disks, or when I didn't have the right settings in RecordNow Max. Since i got that worked out a while back, my success rate has been 100% with any movie that DVD Decrypter and/or DVD Shrink could successfully rip. There have been a few times that ripping wasn't successful with either ripper, and each of those times I also tried ripping with SmartRipper, but it was also unsuccessful.

Long story short... I'd be very surprised if your problems were the fault of DVD Shrink!

[Craig Woodhall]

Chris,

yes, make sure you have the latest Theatertek patch. also, what i found that helps is associate .ifo files with Theatertek and all should work well. I also use MyHTPC as my frontend and it works awesome with DvdShrink/Theatertek from my HD.

Craig

[Bob Sorel]

I see that different people have had different experiences with various programs, but so far I am happy to say that my original "old reliable" method seems to remain tried, true, and well tested. :)

There is certainly nothing wrong with ripping with either DVDD or DVDShrink, and as long as the tools serve you well, then continue to use them. And some, like Schud, still prefer to rip in the ISO mode for reasons that make a lot of sense. I continue to stress my most important piece of advice, which applies equally to ANY method that you might use:

Be sure to test your rip thoroughly! Do not EVER depend on the fact that just because it worked fine 10 times, a 100 times, or in my case, a 1000 times, does not mean that it will work right the next time!"

You can always rerip problem titles, but checking ahead of time will sure save you potential embarrassment some night when you have company over to watch a movie and the film starts up displaying Spanish subtitles..hehe.

This afternon a friend of mine asked for my help with a badly scratched Disney disc in his collection (what do you expect from the kids? :) ) that would no longer play in his Panasonic player. I figured this would be a good opportunity to check out DVDD 3.1.7.0 and its reported tenacity to rip problem discs, but unfortunately it kept getting read errors on one of the main VOBs, even after I told the program to ignore all read errors. After trying different drives for about an hour, I finally gave up and went back to SR, and sure enough, the disc ripped absolutely fine the first time. I was actually concerned that something had gone wrong after seeing how bad a time that DVDD had with the disc, but careful checking of the rip revealed that it was indeed ripped properly. Since the rip was over 7 gigs, I reduced the rip to "movie only" using DVDShrink and then burnt my friend 2 copies, just so he would have a spare when the kids scratched up the first one.

BTW, I use and have used Nero 5.5 for all of my DVD burning, despite reported problems (at Doom9) with this program. It has been an integral part of my "old reliable" method and has only failed to burn the disc properly when it encountered bad media (I ALWAYS verify my burns!). Again, I know that Nero 6 is out, but I still feel that if it ain't broke, then don't fix it.

So use whatever tools make you happy, and whichever methods you feel most comfortable with. Just be sure to keep a copy of SmartRipper and IfoEdit 0.95 safely tucked away somewhere on you hard drive so that you can always whip out "old reliable" if the need arises. :)

Right now my greatest concern has been Tracie's reports of DVDShrink's improper handling of subtitles in "movie only" rips. Hopefully I will have enough time to explore this problem this weekend and at least find a way around this known issue. I'll report back later.

And if you think that the choice of ripper issue has been a hotbed, wait until we discuss the various transcoders. So far we have only talked about DVDShrink, but I have been fully expecting and waiting for the InstantCopy fans to post. :D

[ddlooping]

"...but I have been fully expecting and waiting for the InstantCopy fans to post. :D"
Oh no, not them!!! :D

[monomer]

Originally posted by Bob Sorel
...but I have been fully expecting and waiting for the InstantCopy fans to post. :D

Hey Bob, I suspect all your expectations would be fully met if you opened a thread called "DVD Compression Methods 201"...

[Bob Sorel]

Ok, just call me Super Dave Osborne, as I am now going to perform a foolish stunt and take a stance in regards to InstantCopy: :D

Anyone who still uses this program must be soft in the head! :) (just kidding, of course)

Even though when IC7 first came out, it was a better transcoder than the early competitors, this is no longer true. In my limited testing, I have found that DVDShrink beta 5 in deep analysis mode is as good and often better than IC7, though it still depends on personal opinion as to which is preferred. Considering that DVDShrink is *free*, has more and better features than IC7, and most of all, is far more user friendly, I have a hard time understanding why anyone would still use the Pinnacle beast.

Here's my "feature list" for IC7:

1. Has clumsy, unintuitive interface
2. Has unpredictable, inconsistent, and unreliable file output size
3. Uses a proprietary ISO format (what were these people thinking?)
4. Has tons of bugs and issues (just brouse the "one click solutions" area of Doom 9)
5. Requires registry tweaking to even have a chance of it working decently
6. Requires the use of 3rd party apps to work with its proprietary ISO format
7. Takes an average of 2 hours to do what DVDShrink can do in about 20 minutes

This is a quality program? Though I haven't taken the leap to upgrade to IC 8 (I wonder why :) ), the reports that I have read have been less than stellar, and many of the same issues still exist (or is that ALL of the same issues? :) ).

DVDShrink feature list:

1. Intuitive, friendly, extremely easy to use interface
2. Extremely reliable and predictable file output size
3. Works with real files, not some stupid proprietary ISO format...hehe
4. Very stable with only a couple of bugs that I am aware of (and only recently from the posts in this thread)
5. Doesn't require any registry tweaking...works fine right out of the box :)
6. Doesn't need third party apps, though Autoshrink by nyplayer can be very useful to some
7. Takes an average of 20 minutes to do what IC 7 takes 2 hours to complete

Now I haven't even touched the extra features of DVDShrink that IC 7 can not do. Instead I have just done a head to head of things that they have in common. DVDShrink has nice editing and reauthoring facilities, a built in ripper, and oh yeah, did I mention that it is free? :D

If I only need to compress the movie a small amount (like less than 10% to 15%), then I use DVDShrink, as it is very fast and prduces output quality that is arguably the best of the transcoders. If the movie requires more compression, then CCE remains top dog for PAL video and film and NTSC video based material, though problems still remain with NTSC film remuxing.

Ok, so now I've taken my stand and am prepared to be stoned to death by the IC users. It's all in fun, people, so I hope I haven't ruffled any feathers, and I apologize in advance if I have done so. I would love to hear arguments in favor of IC 7, as I can't find any by myself.

[jimwhite]

One thing I've noticed about DVDShrink, is that it seems to mishandle a flag that has to do with layers. The first 10 or so rips I did were with Smartripper. Since then, I've used Shrink exclusively, in movie only re-author mode. All of the dual-layer Shrink rips, if played with the X-Card player, start at the layer transition point, and do not allow navigation to the beginning of the movie. This is not true for the older rips done with Smartripper. All of the rips play fine with WinDVD or Zoomplayer. :confused:

:cool:

[CThornburgh]

Question for the group:

What is the best way to indentify and rip trailers in addition to the main movie so that DVDLObby can play them as previews to the movie? Should this requirement influence my choice of ripping software (I've been using DVDD in IFO mode, but am having some trouble ID'ing the trailer)? Do you have to rip the trailer separately for this to work?

Thanks!

charles

[schud]

Originally posted by CThornburgh
Question for the group:

What is the best way to indentify and rip trailers in addition to the main movie so that DVDLObby can play them as previews to the movie? ?

Thanks!

charles

Charles,

Do check out DVDShrink. Shrink provides a video preview window which allows you to explore the different titles contained within the disc. It makes it a breeze to identify and remove additional content such as trailers.

[ddlooping]

jimwhite, DVD Shrink next release (which should be fairly soon) will remove the layer-break. :)

[brickie]

this is interesting...iv'e never noticed a pause or anything on my shrink back-ups...is it software or machine dependant?or is this something everyone should notice on there rips with shrink?

brickie

[schud]

Originally posted by brickie
this is interesting...iv'e never noticed a pause or anything on my shrink back-ups...is it software or machine dependant?or is this something everyone should notice on there rips with shrink?

brickie

Me neither. I'd read the complaints at the Digital Digest forums, but having never experienced it, never understood why anybody cared.

[brickie]

it may be dependant on if you use a HTPC or a regular dvd player...i use a htpc,and have not seen a layer change in over 2-3 years..

brickie

[ddlooping]

It is mainly players-dependant, brickie.

Layer-breaks usually cause a slight pause during playback, when the player is being told to change from one layer of a DVD9 to the other.
How long this pause is depends highly on the player (anything between 0.5 to 2 seconds).
Obviously, when ripping a DVD9, the layer-break doesn't physically exist anymore, but DVD Shrink doesn't remove its "flag".
So the pause still appears even though uneccessary.
This has been reported to cause problems for some set-top players (not many though ;))

[brickie]

cool, i figured this was the case...we that use htpc's get the benefit of NEVER having to deal with layer breaks!!!when i use to use a regular dvd player my wife always complained about the layer break..i know that some dvd players have buffers to prevent this in the set top area of players..oh well, glad to see this is not a shrink problem,and still has to do with what you use...for me this was a huge reason for a htpc among others...that break is very disruptive and annoying!!!

brickie

[monomer]

Originally posted by Bob Sorel
...If the movie requires more compression, then CCE remains top dog for PAL video and film and NTSC video based material, though problems still remain with NTSC film remuxing...

Bob... would you care to elaborate on this?
I currently use both DVD2DVD-R and DVD2SVCD (in DVD2DVD 'mode') and I don't believe I've experienced any remuxing problems that one or the other program cannot solve.

Originally posted by Bob Sorel
...Ok, so now I've taken my stand and am prepared to be stoned to death by the IC users. It's all in fun, people, so I hope I haven't ruffled any feathers, and I apologize in advance if I have done so. I would love to hear arguments in favor of IC 7, as I can't find any by myself.

I doubt you'll hear from any IC supporters... you've managed to state your case against IC7 and IC8 too well. I long ago uninstalled both of my versions.

BTW, I've raised my standards again and now relegate only movies between 4.37Gb and ~4.6 (~95%) to the Transcoders (meaning either Shrink or D21 for me) all others go to CCE. At this rate, I'll soon be uninstalling all the transcoders (incl Shrink) and send everything to CCE.

[Bob Sorel]

Bob... would you care to elaborate on this?
I currently use both DVD2DVD-R and DVD2SVCD (in DVD2DVD 'mode') and I don't believe I've experienced any remuxing problems that one or the other program cannot solve.

DVD2DVD-R uses IfoEdit for remuxing, so it works well on both video and film based PAL material, and works equally well on video based NTSC. In order to remux NTSC film based material, the only current solution that I am aware of involves the use of Scenarist, a very expensive program which I can not afford, or involves very time consuming and tedious labor. I am eagerly awaiting a freeware or low priced program that will successfully remux the CCE encodes, and that is why I stated that "problems still remain with NTSC film remuxing".

[monomer]

Gotcha! I see what you mean and you're right, Scenarist does present a major problem... have you tried remuxing with TMPGEnc DVD Author? It costs $68. I thought I had read recently somewhere that someone tried it and had it working. I currently use it for my own custom projects. I'll look into it and get back with you if I come up with anything.
And I believe DVDLab is another choice that some say works. (I believe its about $99).

[jimwhite]

Originally posted by ddlooping
jimwhite, DVD Shrink next release (which should be fairly soon) will remove the layer-break. :)


doesn't help the 100+ rps I have already.... :(

:cool:

[brickie]

jim, setup a htpc and never look back...you will NEVER see a layer change again!!!like i said it is one of the BIG reasons for a htpc, i my opinion...of course picture quality and flexibilty come first.

brickie

[Tracie]

Bob,
I haven't had a chance to get back to the subtitle issue, but IIRC, Ifoedit produced big problems with the Star Wars movies & I had so much success with DVD Shrink processing most of the rest of my titles that I didn't really look back. I'll get to it at some point, but ddlooping spurred me into poking around the Shrink site & it does appear to be a bug in the program. Hopefully it's one that the good Dr. Shrink can fix. :)

On another note, I'm curious to know what sound tracks that people are keeping with their rips? I don't have a digital receiver, so up until now hadn't really payed much attention except to get the AC3 6-channel track. Do any of you prefer the DTS track if available? Just curious, the digital receiver is hopefully in Santa's bag for me. :D

[jimwhite]

Originally posted by brickie
jim, setup a htpc and never look back...you will NEVER see a layer change again!!!like i said it is one of the BIG reasons for a htpc, i my opinion...of course picture quality and flexibilty come first.

brickie

ummmm... the X-Card IS in my HTPC !!!! And yes, I do see layer changes on my HTPC, and no, layer change pause isn't what I was referring to.... once again, if you play a dual layer (>4.7gb) movie that was ripped to a single DVD-r by Shrink with compression, on the X-Cards X-Media Player, it starts at the layer change point..... and you cannot navigate to the start of the movie.... :rolleyes:

:cool:

[schud]

Jim,

I think what Brickie is trying to say is that software DVD players don't suffer from the layer change issue.

Since the X card is its own built-in hardware decoder, it obviously behaves differently.

While I'm not saying that the layer change issue isn't a bug in Shrink, none of the set top boxes I've played DVD Shrunken DVD+R's in have suffered from it either.

I think it's interesting that the X-card does.

[brickie]

that would be exactly what i'm talking about..

jim, that is truely strange...with the availablitiy of softwar edecoders,any particular reason to use one hardware based?i assume the x-card is hardware based....

brickie

[schud]

Originally posted by brickie
with the availablitiy of softwar edecoders,any particular reason to use one hardware based?i assume the x-card is hardware based....

brickie

Well, since I'm already speaking on behalf of everyone else.... ;)

The noteworthy attribute of the Xcard's PDI input is it allows you to input the digital output of your DVD drive straight into the Xcard's PDI input, avoiding the PCI bus entirely, and then use Dscaler to perform deinteraling and pulldown operations.

The biggest advantage, as I understand it, is a) most software players (including TheaterTek, WinDVD, etc.) suck at deinterlacing video based materials (as opposed to film based), and b) users of the Xcard report smooth pans where they had stutter or glitching pans before.

Check this thread: this thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=277041) for the story and evolution of this product.

My, we are getting off topic though, aren't we? :o

[JustinChase]

I am also curious to know which soundtrack everyone is chosing to listen to/backup (when there is a choice) and why.

My understanding is that DTS takes a little more space on the HD, but not much. Is this indicitive of the sound quality (I doubt it) or is it just a by-product of the compression algorithm?

Thanks for your input.

PS I have just backed up my first 2 DVDs using SR and IfoEdit and I am thrilled with the results, no menu, no warning, just good 'ol Movie Fun!

[SIZE=3]I LOVE THIS STUFF!! :D[/SIZE]

[BrianH33]

I always get the DTS track first. If no DTA, then DD5.1. Some DVD's only have DD2.0 sound tracks.

IMHO, DTS does have more detail that DD5.1.

[James Thorne]

When ripping for HTPC I grab the DTS track and movie only and use no additional compression. When preping for a dvdr, I grab the DD track as the slight decrease in sound quality results in better video quality by allowing less video compression in the available space. Also, many stand alone dvd players will not correctly play a dvdr with ONLY a DTS track as they do not include a dts decoder and there is no DD or stereo track to play out the audio jacks, they will not downconvert the dts track.

James

[brickie]

james, if decoding is done by the receiver what difference would it make..you're just passing a signal correct..i do agree with you,i always choose dts when possible..if both are present i normally go ahead and choose both...most of the time the 5% i would gain leaving dts off isn't worth it..

brickie

[Chris Fox]

I've followed this thread since the 101 days, but never got up the nerve to start ripping my DVD collection. I finally decided to give it a go. My goal is to rip just the necessicites (movie, 1 audio, and 1 subtitle. No menus or extras) to my hard drive with no compression. I may go back and burn them to DVD+R later, but for now that is not the issue.

I used DVDShrink to re-author the DVD to my hard drive as movie-only. It seemed to go smoothly. When I open the VOB in PowerDVD to watch, there are no chapter markers in the movie. If I hit chapter advance, it skips to the end of the movie. Very annoying.

Did I do something wrong or is it a limitation I have to deal with?

Thanks,
Chris

[brickie]

i could be wrong,but i think you need to watch it as a dvd in power dvd.choose to open dvd from hard drive, then find appropriate IFO file and play it that way.

brickie

[Chris Fox]

When opening a file from the hard drive, PowerDVD only allows for VOB. It doesn't recognize the other files generated by DVDShrink: IFO or BUP (not sure what the BUP file is)...

Chris

[ddlooping]

Chris Fox, the chapters information is contained in the IFO files. ;)
To be able to play the movie normally you have to use "DVD from folder" (at least that's what it's called in WinDVD).
Also, the folder containing the files must be called "VIDEO_TS" (still when using WinDVD).

- IFO files: contain information relating to the DVD structure (navigation, chapters, what to play and when,...).
- BUP files: identical to the corresponding IFOs (BackUPs).
- VOB files: contain the mixed ("muxed") video, audio and subpicture streams. ;)

[ccclapp]

Originally posted by ddlooping
Chris Fox, the chapters information is contained in the IFO files. ;)
To be able to play the movie normally you have to use "DVD from folder" (at least that's what it's called in WinDVD).
Also, the folder containing the files must be called "VIDEO_TS" (still when using WinDVD).

- IFO files: contain information relating to the DVD structure (navigation, chapters, what to play and when,...).
- BUP files: identical to the corresponding IFOs (BackUPs).
- VOB files: contain the mixed ("muxed") video, audio and subpicture streams. ;)

...and NONE of these issues are related to Shrink...they apply to any DVD back up in File mode.

--Caleb

[Chris Fox]

Found out that the version of PowerDVD that came with my Dell does not support this feature. I downloaded WinDVD; lo and behold, it works fine.

Thanks for helping...

Chris

[brickie]

what version are you using? i use the newest and i can open dvds from hard drive in ifo mode.

brickie

[Chris Fox]

It looks to be a special Dell version of PowerDVD. Version number is 4.0.13c.2409. I tried downloading the latest 4.0 patch from Cyberlink, but it said it was not compatible with my version. Dell had a patch on their site (to build 2621), but still no "open from HD" option. It has an "Open From Media" selection; however, it did not allow selection of the IFO, only the VOB.

Chris

[ddlooping]

"Thanks for helping..."

You're welcome. ;)

[Mary H]

Originally posted by Chris Fox
It looks to be a special Dell version of PowerDVD. Version number is 4.0.13c.2409. I tried downloading the latest 4.0 patch from Cyberlink, but it said it was not compatible with my version. Dell had a patch on their site (to build 2621), but still no "open from HD" option. It has an "Open From Media" selection; however, it did not allow selection of the IFO, only the VOB. Chris Just to confirm, Chris, I got a new Dell about a year ago, and had the same experience with their version of PowerDVD. You're right, it does not have the "Open DVD from Hard Drive" option. Luckily, I already owned PowerDVD 4 XP, so I just upgraded it.

[brickie]

i just checked my system a little while ago, and the option is there for me..i use 4.0.there is an option to "open dvd files from hard drive"..works extremely well.

brickie

[Mary H]

Originally posted by brickie
i just checked my system a little while ago, and the option is there for me..i use 4.0.there is an option to "open dvd files from hard drive"..works extremely well. brickie That's what I was trying to point out... the standard 4.0 version of PowerDVD includes that choice. The Dell version does not.

[cmcjo]

I just completed the ripping of 200 DVD's to my hard drives using DVDshrink

I have TheaterTEK and power DVD installed as well as DVD Lobby 3.

If I just want to watch a movie using Theatertek, what is the easiest way? If I try to navigate to the movie folder, I cannot open the video_TS file.
I can only open a VOB file. Is that right? Is there something that should be done so that I can acess the Video_ts files?

Thanks,

[schud]

Originally posted by cmcjo
If I just want to watch a movie using Theatertek, what is the easiest way? If I try to navigate to the movie folder, I cannot open the video_TS file.
I can only open a VOB file. Is that right? Is there something that should be done so that I can acess the Video_ts files?

Thanks,

Make sure you are patched to the latest version of TheaterTek, 1.15.56. Then right click on the video_ts.ifo file, select "open with" then select TheaterTek. If you always want windows to launch TT when opening video_ts.ifo files, then select the box "always use this application for these files" (or something close to that).

[cmcjo]

HI,
I am running 1.5.0.56, I would have thought that would be the latest since I just purchased it 3 days ago ?

Thanks for your response, I just need to associate Theatertek with the _ts ifo files. It is working now.

[Samuel Grave]

Hi,

A strange thing happened to me.

The first DVD I have ripped was ICE AGE PAL version. I have only removed the FBI warnings with IfoEdit0.96.

When i tryed to record it, using NERO 6 to create a DVD-VIDEO, I received the following message:
'- file size is not a multiple of a logical block size (2kB) disc may not run'
I have tested it in a DVD-RW and everything worked fine, the DVD even played in my DVD player.

I would like to know if anyone knows why this happenned? I have ripped more DVDs and this haven't happened again.

Thanks.

[Samuel Grave]

Other strange thing that happened to me.

I have tryed using DVDShrink 3.0 beta5.

I have used it on Die Another Day PAL and Ali G PAL.
I have ripped the DVDs with smartripper and then used DVDShrink on the HDs files.

On both discs i have re-authored only the movie with a compress ratio of 97%.

I have tested it on my HTPC and everything ran flawlessly. Then i recorded it in DVD-R and it still ran flawlessly in the HTPC. When i tested it in my DVD player the image was ok, but every other 20 seconds it appears severe pixelation on the image, like when the player could not read the disc.

Before using DVDShrink, i have tryed to split the first movie in two discs using IfoEdit0.96 and then recorded it to a DVD-R. It worked flawlessly in my DVD player.

I presume the problem is not in the DVD-R media, because this pixelation effect only appears in the DVDShrink versions...

I am curious to what DVDShrink is doing to compress the DVD size... Can anyone explain me, or pointing me any link to a description of transcoding?

Thanks.

Samuel

[brickie]

that is strange..EVERY dvd i have backed up has played flawless!!!in my computer as well as my standalone.

brickie

[phcjpp]

Wow great thread - I wonder if one of you would mind doing me a favour and giving me the complete spec for their HTPC they use for ripping/ viewing. I will be using dvd-shrink and already have TheaterTek I'm looking for info on

Grapics Card (Radeon 9800XT ?)
Motherboard (?)
Processor (3.0+ p4 I guess)
Memory
Sound card (I already have a digi98-pad if suitable)
Case
Power supply
Any cooling you are using
Extra software

There seem to be so many hardware issues floating around that it will be simpler to copy someones working system. I intend to rip dvd's to a 4TB media server and play from that over gigbyte lan.

Thanks in advance
Chris

[visualbyte]

to jimwhite or any one else that may have solved this issue, i also have Xcard and am suffering the start at some point in the movie and not being able to navigate to the begining which is some wot frustrating. Has a solution be found to this. im using DVDshink to do movie only back up with no compression and then Img Tool to turn subsqent files back to iso for deamon tools to mount it all seem to work fine power dvd plays it from the begining but xcard always plays it from somewere else.

[Tracie]

Wow great thread - I wonder if one of you would mind doing me a favour and giving me the complete spec for their HTPC they use for ripping/ viewing. I will be using dvd-shrink and already have TheaterTek I'm looking for info on

Hi Chris,

I'll give you my setup:

Mobo: Asus A7V8X
CPU: Athlon 1700 XP
Ram: 512 MB DDR
Video: Radeon 9600 non-pro
Sound: M-Audio Revolution
Case: I'm using a Directron, but will be buying an Antec Overture soon (comes with a TruePower 380).
PS: Antec TruePower 430
Cooling: 2 60s in the rear, 1 80 in the front all undervolted to 7v
Software: Windows XP Home, Powerstrip, Radeon Cat 3.4 drivers (important for doing 1080i in Theater Tek), Theater Tek, Xlobby (frontend), Winamp (music), JRiver Media Center 9.1 (ripping CDs & playing media files), DVD Decrypter, DVD Shrink, Ifoedit

The only thing that you may be limited on with this setup is if you try to use any post processing with DVD playback (such as ffdshow) you may not have enough CPU. I don't use ffdshow, but not for that reason. I just found that the PQ is better without it. I'm going to change the case to the Overture in the next few weeks for several reasons, the main ones being noise/cooling. Other than that, this system is awesome.

[shunx]

Sorry if this has been posted before, maybe everyone already knows this but I just realized that Daemon Tool has the command line image mounting option which makes it easier to access a DVD image. This way the OS acts as the front end. One double click on the file link and the movie will play automatically assuming you have a default DVD player. This also makes it ok to store images randomly across the network, since the links to them can be centralized under one directory.

[phcjpp]

Thanks Tracie,

What sort of ripping speeds do you get with that ?

Chris

[Tracie]

What sort of ripping speeds do you get with that ?

Hi Chris,
With DVD Decrypter, usually about 6x - 7x (last time I looked, anyway). I usually just set up the rip & then go work on something else, so I haven't checked in a while. Also, I think that the DVD-Rom that you use has some effect on it (some, it would seem, are locked at 2x). I'm using a Samsung drive & other than it being loud when playing music (which is why I'm in the process of ripping my cd collection), seems to be pretty good.

I'd be curious to know what kind of ripping speeds others are getting from their systems.

[dstroot]

Question for Jim White - I was ripping my DVDs according to "Ripping 101" - smartripper in all files mode and then IFOedit... Watching them with TheaterTek. Life is grand.

Then I bought the xCard/PDI combo. Can't figure out how to make xCard play the rips - since I don't have the ISO images to mount - only the files that result after the ripping 101 process. TheaterTek plays them just fine.

How have you made the xCard work? Thanks in advance.

[RScogland]

I ripped a few DVD's to my harddrive using DVD Shrink and then re-authored them to only include:

the main movie (zero cormpression)
the DD soundtrack
(no subtitles)

My computer has PowerDVD version 4 and ZoomPlayer Pro latest version, running with the PowerDVD filters. For now, I just want to play them from my harddrive. When I click on the VIDEO_TS (IFO) file it plays fine initially, and chapter skips work initially. However, after skipping several chapters, I find that it misses the rest of them and goes to warnings, special features, etc ... the stuff I didn't even want. For example, on one movie the first five chapters were fine and then it ended. On another movie, the first 14 chapters were fine, and then it skipped to the warning page, and "making of" feature. Does any of this quirkyness sound familiar? Anything for me to try?

[jimwhite]

The rips I make are all to 4.7gb DVD-R's, using re-author mode. I haven't had any of the problems that Rick S. is having, but with the X-Card, as I've previously said, it often starts at the layer change point instead of the beginning of the movie. Apparently this is because the XCard software looks at an obscure flag that DVDShrink sets incorrectly. The author of DVDShrink has indicated he will check into this, but that won't help the 150 or so Rips I've already done.... sigh.... guess I'll but TT as well.... :D

:cool:

[dstroot]

Jim - so you play them off the DVD-r disk, not your HD? I can't figure out how to play them off the HD with the Xcard.

As an FYI they have a new release of the Xcard software - maybe that might help?

[ddlooping]

Hi all,

DVD Shrink forthcoming release, v3.1, will remove the "layer-change" flag. :)

Please view the following thread for an updated list of features available in v3.1:
http://forum.digital-digest.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=25207 ;)

Merry Christmas to all, and best wishes for the new year. :D

[windtrader]

Rick S,

Have you had good luck on other movies, using Shrink to copy just the main movie or is this a new process for you?

If you have not done this before make sure you start Shrink, open the movie disc, Click on the Main Movie folder to make sure you see Title 1. Then click on the Re-author button at the top. Drag the title from the first window into the new window (reauthor). You can select audio and no subs there. click backup and this should do it. Make sure you are playing the movie from the ripped directory.

[RScogland]

Originally posted by windtrader
Rick S, Have you had good luck on other movies, using Shrink to copy just the main movie or is this a new process for you?

I've done two movies so far (not successfully). For purposes of this exercise, lets randomly pick a movie and pretend one of them is named "Movie X". The main movie is referred to as "Title 1, 6-14." I click re-author, and drag that over to the New DVD section. I de-select the 2-channel audio (leaving only the 6-channel audio) and de-select subtitles, and I click zero compression ... it then says it will be ... ~25,000 MB!!! I am then able to preview titles 1 and 6-14 ... it turns out that title 1 shows everything I want, and is a more realistic ~5,000 MB. I assume this should be all I need, but I'm not trying again, because the first three times I tried, it would only play the first five (or so) chapters. Do I need to select more of the chapters? I don't want to keep ripping and deleting, but I also don't want to give up. Based on what I've read in the last few posts, I hope the fix for the layer change bug in DVD Shrink will solve my problem.

[Mary H]

Originally posted by RScogland
I've done two movies so far (not successfully). For purposes of this exercise, lets randomly pick a movie and pretend one of them is The Matrix. The main movie is referred to as "Title 1, 6-15." I click re-author, and drag that over to the New DVD section. I de-select the 2-channel audio (leaving only the 6-channel audio) and de-select subtitles, and I click zero compression ... it then says it will be ... 25,275 MB!!! I am then able to preview titles 1 and 6-15 ... it turns out that title 1 shows everything I want, and is a more realistic 5,052 MB. I assume this should be all I need, but I'm not trying again, because the first three times I tried, it would only play the first five (or so) chapters. Do I need to select more of the chapters? I don't want to keep ripping and deleting, but I also don't want to give up. Here are the chapters I can select from in the "Main Movie" section:
Rick, I was going to put in my copy of the Matrix to check this out, but it appears to be loaned out to my son! Just recalling what i've seen with some other movies, though, i think what you need to do is this: After you open the movie in DVD Shrink, go to "View" on the menu and deselect "Combine Shared Titles". I wish there was some way to make this the default, because it seems like i have to do it pretty often! Then you can drag just the movie title over to the reauthor window, without all that extraneous junk tagging along.

EDIT: BTW, it just happens that the Matrix is one of the most problematic titles around for shrinking! It seems it's full of things like special angles, alternate paths you can take (like the white rabbit stuff), etc. I've read lots and lots of threads about it.

[RScogland]

I gave it another shot. I get the first four chapters fine, and instead of the fifth chapter, what I get is the main menu ... forever. It does rip the entire ~ 2 hour movie, but all I end up getting out of it is 21 minutes of movie followed by a real long menu.

[schud]

Sorry for your problems Rick. But I have to say, there must be something wrong with your technique, because I've succesfully ripped 110 movies and counting, including the Matrix, with no problems.

I wish I could point out precisely what your problem is. :(

[SOCAL-HTPC]

Ive ripped 3 movies, 3 different ways - all playback with serious flaws somewhere. Either audio / video sync after a couple chapters, or audio dropouts to frame stutter.

Ive ripped Gladiator | Full Metal Jacket | Blade 2 - they were selected as a test based solely on their proximity of them to my hand and the shelf when I reached.

Intel MOBO 850MV
P4 1.8ghz [non Hyper Thread shiz]
512 MB RAMBus RAM
IBM 7200 rpm EIDE drives 120 and 80 GB
Matrox G550 Dual VGA headed card
Creative SB basic sound card - type forgotten
Dual Samsung Syncmaster 19" 191T LCD's
Using PowerDVD 4 that came with my other vid capture systems ATI 9700 card. [so far NOT impressed with PowerDVD]

I am testing hard drive based DVD playback before rolling out a mainlobby fronted HTPC for my Hitachi 51" widescreen HD tv and pioneer vsx36 receiver. So far my results have been FAR from acceptable. Im sure Ive hacked somehting somewhere in the rip process. Ive tried smartripper first, but thought that a bit too many steps. Then DVDDecrypter, then DVDShrink. Smartripper worked best, then dvddecrypter, then worst overall problematic reuslts coming from the DVDShrink rips. Looks like for me - the tried and true recipe of smartripper and ifoedit is what Im gonna run with ... until I can get a better grip on DVDshrinks interface and toolset.

Id like to read/see/hear how you pro's are using IFOedit to get "MOVIE ONLY" rips - no menues and the audio track of choice .... and not have sync issues.

Is my sound card not up to par? Software for it needs updating perhaps?

Video card the problem?

Im currently not a big fan of powerdvd 4x. Wish TheaterTek had a demo to download, I mean this si 2003 .... :-)

[JustinChase]

SOCAL,

Have you read Part 1 of this thread? There was a great explanation on how to use SR and IfoEdit together to get a 'movie only' rip. The instructions are located in 2 or 3 different posts. The IfoEdit instructions are about 8 to 10 posts down?

I have one suggestion to make to the process, however.

It is suggested to make 2 folders/directories for the process, one labeled movie - original and another labeled movie - final. I have streamlined this for my needs by making a folder with the movie title as the name for the folder, then I go in and make the VIDEO_TS subfolder. Once this is done, I just copy and paste it, which gives me a folder titled Copy of 'movie title'. I know this Copy of folder is for the entire movie rip, and I strip out the 'junk' into the 'movie title' folder and delete the 'Copy of' folder and I'm done. No re-naming anything, and I only have to create the VIDEO_TS file once, since it copies along with the 'movie title' folder. Saves ma a couple of minutes:)

[RScogland]

Originally posted by schud
Sorry for your problems Rick. But I have to say, there must be something wrong with your technique, because I've succesfully ripped 110 movies and counting, including the Matrix, with no problems.


There are so few options in DVD Shrink, that it seems like it should be easy to pinpoint what is wrong with my technique (if anything). The only thing I can think of is the "limit file size to 1 GB" option ... I wanted one big file, so I un-checked that option ... should I re-check it? Unless someone can tell me that is the problem, I still think it must be that the layer change issue affects my system even though it doesn't affect everyone. I honestly think I "successfully ripped" them ... just not in a way that allows useful playback.

[schud]

Rick, yes, I would uncheck that. The DVD "specification," if you will, is based upon a VOB file of no bigger than 1GB. That could be your problem.

It will be interesting to know if it is the problem.

[brickie]

I AGREE WITH SCHUD, UNTIL I UNCHECKED THAT, I HAD MAJOR RIP PROBLEMS...NOW IV'E RIPPED OVER 40 MOVIES WITHOUT A SINGLE HICCUP!!dvdshrink is the best thing since sliced bread...it just does not get easier or better..i get no layer pauses,or out of sync anything...hope you can figure out what is wrong.

brickie

[brickie]

okay first problem rip...i ripped my copy of 2 fast 2 furious and it stops playing after chapter 13,in powerdvd and zoom with sonics filters...strange thing is if i play thru theatertek(sonic filters of course) it plays fine!!!!!anybody else had any problems with this dvd..i'm wondering if i should re-rip thru dvd decrptor?

brickie

[RScogland]

It worked! I re-checked the "limit file size to 1 GB" option, and I've since ripped two DVD's and played them back without problems. Thanks for all the help!

[monomer]

Originally posted by Bob Sorel
DVD2DVD-R uses IfoEdit for remuxing, so it works well on both video and film based PAL material, and works equally well on video based NTSC. In order to remux NTSC film based material, the only current solution that I am aware of involves the use of Scenarist, a very expensive program which I can not afford, or involves very time consuming and tedious labor. I am eagerly awaiting a freeware or low priced program that will successfully remux the CCE encodes, and that is why I stated that "problems still remain with NTSC film remuxing".

Bob, sorry it took so long to get back to you but I've been so busy with my work and life in general... anyway, I've reach a 'pause' in things and have recently had some time to experiment with using DVDauthor for remuxing of re-encoded (DVD) video with AC3 audio... it works beautifully! So you can use CCE basic ($53) and DVDauthor ($68) and DVD2DVD-R (free but a donation to Chatwalker would be better)... and you can re-encode main movie only! at a reasonable price. Some limitations that I'm aware of... only one sound track (AC3, unfortunately no DTS capability), chapter points are not transferred however you can create your own chapter points if you wish, no subtitle capability. Anyway just thought I'd mention it here just in case anyone was interested.

Oh, and I believe the next version of DVD2SVCD (free) will use DVDauthor as well...

[brickie]

just curious,with shrink and nero recode,why would you want to do it this way?

brickie

[monomer]

Recode and shrink are only transcoders (they simply remove info) while CCE actually re-encodes the movies just like the studios did when originally transferring from film to digital, it just uses a lower bitrate so the final movie will fit onto a single layer DVD. You can really see the difference when you try to compress a movie down to 70% or less of its original size. If your system and display are good enough... make that 85% or less.

BTW, DVD2One and InstantCopy are also merely transcoders.

[JustinChase]

I have read that many studios incorrectly encode DVDs. I can't give any specific examples, but it sounds common that they will incorrectly flag a film as a video, or vice versa.

This gives many DVD players (software or hardware) trouble and leads to display errors (combing, etc).

If one was so inclined, could one re-encode a DVD backup with one of these methods, and fix these errors? Or would the re-encoding software just introduce more/other errors and not be worth the effort/time required.

Anyone have any experience with this?

[brickie]

Originally posted by monomer
Recode and shrink are only transcoders (they simply remove info) while CCE actually re-encodes the movies just like the studios did when originally transferring from film to digital, it just uses a lower bitrate so the final movie will fit onto a single layer DVD. You can really see the difference when you try to compress a movie down to 70% or less of its original size. If your system and display are good enough... make that 85% or less.

BTW, DVD2One and InstantCopy are also merely transcoders.

i'm still not quite sure what you mean..shrink can do everything that the other program(s) you mentioned can do.and it supports dts...i'm sure i'm not quite understanding you...just trying to figure out what the advantage is doing it the other way...i watch shrinked movies on a 80" x 45" screen and can't really tell the difference..NOBODY else can especially that has come into my home...plus i can keep my dts track if i want...just trying to figure out WHY doing it the other way would be better...if the picture is BETTER,then i could see it...but most everyone that uses shrink think it's the best..

brickie

[schud]

Brickie,

Other than the infrequent "bugs" some users may encounter using Shrink, there is no advantage to using one of the other "encoding" methods UNLESS you are trying to reduce the size down so that it will fit on a standard DVD-+/-R. That's where you may experience an improvement.

If you really want to understand the difference between encoding and transcoding, I suggest you read
this thread at Doom9. (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=63587) It's excellent!

Now that I found Shrink, I'm too lazy to fool with the others! :p As always, YMMV. ;)

[monomer]

Brickie, try this...
take a movie that you know was compressed to 70% or less (Shrink will tell you this information before you actually do the transcode)... now fast forward until you can find a scene with human faces that are in sharp focus but very small such as in a crowd scene and look carefully at the individual expressions on their faces... do you see facial features (eyes, noses, lips) that appear to 'float' around and make reading their expression impossible. Ok, now pull out the original and play the very same scene back... it should look very different, facial expressions should be very 'readable' , clear and distinct. Ok, now search for a scene with either leaves, tree bark, sand, or grass blades in sharp focus and now go back to your transcoded back-up version and look at the same scene... do the leaves, tree bark, etc appear to be 'crawling' around. This would not have happened if the movie had been re-encoded. The advantage of re-encoding is when you must really 'squash' down the file size to get a movie to fit onto a single recordable DVD. I have re-encoded movies to less than 50% of its original file size without any viewable loss in picture quality on a ~114" wide front projected image using 1:1 pixel mapping (of course any statement made about PQ judgements must be qualified by mentioning that all PQ assessments are dependent upon the DVD player, the display being use, and the viewer's knowledge of what to look for and also the viewer's physical capabilities - eyesight, motion sensitivity, etc.) Don't get me wrong here, I'm not trying to sell you anything... I personally find that using CCE is an invaluable tool in my DVD compression tool arsenal and use it often but I also realise that the expense in both time and money make it inaccessible to many others... well, I'm just saying that the expense in money investment has now just been lowered substantially (from ~$35,000 to $68).

[kniaz]

I am not sure if anyone posted this or not, but the greatest web site for information relating to DVD burning as well as player compatibility between different media, burning software, and even media compatibility based on speed and brand is DVDRHelp (http://www.dvdrhelp.com)

[Kschorz]

Well, I made it through most of 'Ripping 101' using SmartRipper to rip my Blade Runner DVD then used DVDSTarter to get it ready to play/edit. Took a peek at the movie with WinDVD 5 and the PQ is outstanding but there is NO audio!!

Any ideas?

Thank you

[Delvo]

Originally posted by Tracie
T2, Ultimate Edition (has alternate ending)What's the other ending?

[ccclapp]

I know this is a bit OT, but it is the holiday season ;)

I gave my kids a few Barbie and other computer games/programs. They require one to insert the CD in order to play the program (after previously installing the program). I would like to do two things you may be able to help me with:

1) Make a back-up CD for daily use so I can store the originals away (so my 3-7 year-olds don't ruin yet another CD/DVD)

2) Keep a HD copy of the CD so they/I do not need to keep searching for CDs every time we use a different program.

I tried to copy the disk with Nero6. It seemed to copy, I was able to install the software on my office PC. However, when I installed the copy and tried to play the program it did not work. I also burned an image of the CD to HD and the same thing happened. Am I dealing with some kind of copy protection? Is there an equivalent program to DVD Decrypter I need to use? I have not dealt with computer games before.

Thanks

Caleb

[Tracie]

What's the other ending?

Delvo,
I haven't watched it, just scanned through it to check the rip, but it shows Sarah Connor as an old woman sitting on the park benches at the playground that she has visions of throughout the movie. She's writing in a journal, with narration in the background, & watching her son Jon & her granddaughter(?) on the playset. That's about it, like I said I haven't really watched it, but I can assume that it's the same kind of positive look to the future that the theatrical ending had.

Shud,
Is there an update from Dr. Shrink on the subtitle issue?

Caleb,
Check out this link:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=302623

It talks about backing up games.

[ccclapp]

Thanks for the link Tracie...this looks good. If any others of you have experience or links backing up games, I'd welcome your $.02. If this gets into a big discussion I will break off into a separate thread.

While we are on these related (buy somewhat OT) subjects, what about backing up PC program disks? Is this like games, DVDs, or yet another methodology?

Caleb

[Tracie]

Hmmm, that I don't think I can help you with. There are a couple of forums called Ars Technica & Anandtech that are more specific to computers in general than this site is, & it might be worth searching/posting this topic over on those sites.

http://forums.anandtech.com/
http://episteme.arstechnica.com/6/ubb.x

Hope that helps.

[brickie]

from my understanding the program you seek is called alcohol..i know a few people that use it to backup and burn their games..

brickie

[kniaz]

ccclap,

you can do one of 2 things - create an ISO image of the disc or copy the entire contents of the disc. Creating an ISO image can be done using Nero - you need to look for an option to write a disc image to a file or something like that - I am not familiar with Nero to know off the top of my head where that option is. After that, you can take that ISO image and burn it back onto a CD giving you a perfect backup copy.

To run the program off the hard drive you can mount the ISO file as a drive letter, but it gets too complicated and unstable - I am only listing it here so that you'd know it is possible. The best thing you can do is copy the entire content of the disc to hard drive. But you have to make sure that you are copying hidden files and directories. Depending on your OS, you can enable the view hidden files and directories option when you open Explorer (like double-click on your My Desktop icon), go to Tools -> Folder Options -> View.

Then make sure you select all of the files and directories on the CD - best way to do it is to double-click on the drive icon under my computer, and then go to Edit - Select All. Then go to Edit - Copy. Open up the directory where you want to keep the files on the hard drive and select Edit - Paste.

Now for working/not working part. Most games have a variety of copy protection mechanisms in them, requiring CD to run is one of them. If you want to run the game without the CD, you have to uninstall the game. Copy the CD to the hard drive, and then run install from there. That way, it will think that it was installed from the hard drive and will look there for needed confirmation of copy protection. With that being said, it still may not work as some games will still ask for CD, but it is worth a try.

Hope this helps.

[Hyrax]

Hello -
I've got some VOB files on my hard drive that I wish to convert back to MPEG-2 files without loss of resolution. Is there a tool out there that will let me do the conversion? I've looked at DVDx, but it appears to also compress the file.

Thanks,
Tim

[Mr.Poindexter]

OK, I have finished ripping my entire DVD collection onto my server. I tried to run them in PowerDVD just to check for the region issue (only about 10% had it) but I find that if there is a file named VIDEO_TS.IFO, I can select it and everything will run just fine.

However, most of my files have a subdirectory called vts_0x (where x is 1-7 that i have seen, though there may be more numbers) and all the files have the vts_0x prefix on them, so the file might look like this:
vts_04VIDEO_TS.IFO

When I select that to play, it won't work. I am guessing that I just need to rename them by removing the vts_0x prefix and deleting the subdirectory. The files are not in that subdirectory and I didn't select the make subdirectories option in SmartRipper, so I don't know why they are there.

Anyway, I just wanted to check here before I started working on them to make sure that is the correct thing to do.

Thanks,
Mike

[jflatt]

I gave DVDShrink 3.1.1 a try. I am a 'main movie only' type person. After Shrink does its thing, I check out the resulting IFO with IFOEdit. The IFO will show all of the foreign language tracks and subpictures that I excluded. I can see from the filesize that they are not in the vobs, but the IFO is still referencing them. Is this a problem, or should I just stick with using IFOEdit to do my rips?

[ddlooping]

jflatt, you could try changing the "Logical remapping..." in the "Preferences" menu.
However, the tests I conducted showed the audio/subpicture streams I had deleted were removed from my software and set-top players menus, as expected. ;)

[Delvo]

Way back there, someone said that a particular ripper is the "king" and that no transcoder could ever compete with it (but I guess it's supposedly better than other re-encoders as well). A few others later also stated, not even as opinion but as fact (though I've noticed that opinions often get expressed as facts by machine enthusiasts whether the machine is a fighter jet, a computer, or a car), that re-encoding is better than transcoding, always, by definition, inherently.

And yet, strangely, at least two of the most populat rippers are said to be "mere" transcoders, not re-encoders. Is this just elitism by people using less popular programs, feeling the need to trashtalk the more common ones like DVD Shrink as not being real true DVD rippers?

What's the difference between transcoding and re-encoding? The first time this was defined here that I saw, I actually got the impression that transcoding should be better (at least for me), but that it wasn't really a bid deal either way and I'd choose my ripper based on features and ease of use and price. Now I'm seeing that one factor treated as if it's a huge overwhelming difference that makes anything made by one kind of program just hopelessly inferior to the products of the other kind. So what's the deal here?

And is there a comprehensive list of which rippers are which? What are DVD Decrypter and Smartripper? (Those are the only other two I've seen named often enough to remember their names.)

[Mr.Poindexter]

Re-encoding will result in some loss in picture quality. For many people, myself included, makes those systems utterly worthless. DVD shrink does not have to re-encode.

Re-encoding doesn't give you a bit for bit copy of the original. I have to have the exact same audio stream from the DVD as the original or it will not sync with my Odyssee motion simulator. As I spent a lot of money for it, I don't want to make it not work to save $0.85 of hard drive space.

[Delvo]

Another question: Where in the world to get Power DVD, Win DVD, Theater Tek, and DVD Lobby? Doom9 doesn't have download links for players; only rippers and other types.

(And my Smartripper download is a .RAR file; what on Earth is that and how do I install from it?)

[Hyrax]

The way I understand it, re-encoding will take HOURS, transcoding takes minutes. IMHO, re-encoding would have to rival the second coming to make it worth while.

Look for WinRar (www.winrar.com ???) in google. RAR is a more efficient compression method [edit: than ZIP] and quite common.

Edit: As Mr. Poindedexter points out in the following post, the programs you've asked about (Power DVD and so forth) are all commercial products that you need to buy somehow. I do know that PowerDVD comes with a number of Video cards, but I'm not sure where to buy the others.

[Mr.Poindexter]

Well, if you want DVD Lobby, don't look for a free link. Mario who programmed it is a regular here and I don't think anybody here would give it away. There is, however, a free trial if you go to his website:
http://www.webpromotion.com/cinemar/index.html

[windtrader]

I use both transcoding and re-encoding software. Like most things, you can not reduce the discussion to "what's the best", and the answer is as most things, "It depends".

Time - transcoding will be faster with one pass (no analysis pass). With both the analysis and transode pass, it may be possible for a single pass OPV encode to come pretty close. But for practical purposes, transcoding is faster.

Quality - on movies are pretty close to fitting on a single disc, then resultant quality will be about the same. I find that transcoding movies that need less than 10-15% compressions are as good as re-encoding.

When you start compressing long movies, say 2 1/2 to 3 hours plus, then encoding will result in higher quality results.

Observed quality also depends on the playback system. If you play movies back onto a 25" tv vs a 100" FP, you will see less problems, so the quality may seem closer. On a high resolution system, the artifacts will become much more noticable.

Observed quality also depends on the source. If the source is flat and soft, lacking in full resolution, then the method of compressing will not matter as much.

Flexibility - Transcoders like DVDShrink, Nero Recode, DVD2ONE, etc. have a limited amount of flexibility when compared to encoding. If you encode you can manipulate the source with many different filters that can sharpen, soften, remove noise, change 43 lbx format to anamorphic, shrink the size of the picture to overcome the loss of picture that occurs via overscan. You can add new subtitles, change the color and location of the subtitles, etc.

Overall, transcoders are great for day to day backups and encoders are great to handle the long movies and those that need special treatment.

[monomer]

Yeah... everything windtrader said...

Delvo, I think you're getting a few things confused. Ripping is basically about getting the movie files off the disc and onto your harddrive (this requires Decrypting). DVDDecrypter, SmartRipper, and Vstrip are popular ripping programs. (DVDDecrypter can write also.)

Once the movie is on your harddrive, if it is small enough you can write it to a DVD-R. If its too big you can either split it over 2 DVD-Rs (DVDFab is a program that does this very easily... but there are others as well) this solution will provide a bit-for-bit copy... or... If instead you wish to get the whole movie onto only 1 DVD-R then you must compress the file somehow... this is where the choice between transcoding or re-encoding comes into play. Audio is never compressed with either method, only the video.

Transcoding tries to remove video information that you can't really see anyway (for instance... in dark scenes where adjacent pixels are very similar in color) but if you ask it to remove too much information things will start to appear blocky and/or grainy as well as motion artifacts, especially in darker scenes and scenes where lost detail counts (such as individual facial features in a crowd scene... their eyes and noses will actually float around, or leaves, grass, sand, tree bark, etc. begin to 'crawl' around). This can happen with as little as 10% compression or it might need as much as 50% compression, it really is dependant upon how much detail (bitrate) was there to begin with (and your display system). The higher the bitrate, the more detail can be 'lost' without obvious macro-blocking... however for most movies, its common to start seeing these artifacts at about 20% compression (on a 10-foot wide-screen, LCD or DLP projection) and about 40% on a 27" TV.

If you chose to re-encode, the audio and video must first be separated (demuxed) so that the video can be 'worked' on and then at the end of the process the two must be "woven" back together (muxed).
Re-encoding involves actually reversing the encoding process (uncompressing) and encoding it all again but this time with a new bitrate... usually the process involves several "passes" so that the available bits can be distributed advantageously (ie. the complex and fast action scenes get the most bits while the darker scenes get less, etc.) Re-encoding in NOT a lossless process and therefore creates its own visual artifacts (mostly loss of edge detail or edge "ringing"). However with that said... re-encoding looks REALLY GOOD!!! even at massive compression ratios (50% and more). The trade-off is all these "passes" and encoding takes time... lots of time and everything must be re-assembled (and re-authored) again, adding to the complexity of the whole process (or as windtrader said "flexibility" if you like).

The common wisdom usually goes as windtrader has already stated... at small compression ratios <10% transcoding is not only faster but can look better (ex. no edge ringing)... however (depending on your display system) above 15%-25% re-encoding will probably be the better of the two and above 25% or so it's usually no contest... re-encoding wins.

DVDShrink is a ripper AND a transcoder and does some types of re-authoring... and prograns like Instant Copy and DVD2One are transcoders that do some re-authoring but do NOT rip (decrypt). CCE and TMPGEnc are encoders but obviously you will require other programs to demux/mux/ re-author etc... there are a couple of "near" one-click options that I know of... DVD2DVD-R and DVD2SVCD (in DVD2DVD mode)... these are programs that automate almost all of the steps involved in re-encoding (and there are quite a few steps involved).

Hope this helps to alleviate some of the confusion and if I made any errors in the foregoing please (to all) feel free to correct me... I'm still learning about this stuff too, just like the rest of you... I just thought someone might be able to benefit from the little bit I know.