Zenith DVB318 Upscaling DVD player info thread

[robert123]

I will recap here what was in this (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=326524&perpage=20) thread so that it is not buried.

The Zenith DVB318 will be a 1080i/720p DVD player with DVI out. It will not play DVD-A or SACD. I tried to find out pricing and availability info, but none was available at this time.

Note that the DVB318 was first announced at CES (2003) as a DVD-A/SACD capable DVD player. It was then reannounced at CEDIA as an HD DVD player, at which time the info currently on Zenith's website was put online. It was removed after a little while and was just recently put back online (a good sign it is nearing product shipment). It has not, however, been updated to include full details of the unit.

Someone provided info in this (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=327537) thread about the LG DV-7832 HD DVD player that will be sold in Canada. It should be essentially the same product as the DVB318.

Robert

[robert123]

The owner's manual can now be downloaded. Go to http://us.lgservice.com/ and click on Owner's Manuals. Search by model under the DVD Players category.

Replace http://us with http://ca for the Canadian version.

Robert

[NickB]

hmm, no mention of dvi out on their website.

[Mr. Biggles]

Originally posted by NickB
hmm, no mention of dvi out on their website.


If you look at the owners PDF guide it clearly shows the DVI port .

[Po\/\/eR]

Thanks Robert :D

I have been looking everywhere like crazy, to find info about that player, now with the manual, it is a prety good start.

Now we just have to wait until someone gets it, and give us is impression...I hope it turn out to be a good unit.

[Robert Whitehead]

According to an LG CRP, probable release is 1stQ 2004 with a price of $200 to $300. However, the CRP I spoke with was not sure, and w/the Canada release, I wouldn't be surprised if it were sooner.

Info on deinterlacer, scaler, and MPEG decoder in unit not available although it will apparently be the same as in the LG LST-3510A combo HDTV Rec'r/DVD player w/DVI HCDP out.

[Robert Whitehead]

I read the Owners manual for the DVB318 and it looks suspiciously like the Samsung HD931. The menu system and OSD are nearly the same, and the remote preserves the Samsung's quirk of having chap skip and scan be the same buttons. It has the 3D sound option of the Samsung and similar features.

[Po\/\/eR]

The only thing I relly care about is, if it use the DVI video standard (like the GWIII) and not the PC standard (like the 931).

I see also a lot of similarity with the 931, I hope it is not the case for the DVI standard.

On the other hand there is a lot of additional features and differences, like a jug on the remote, so skip & scan on same button not an issue :). And the best part is this statement from the manual "Some HD Monitors designed for PC applications using DVI-D may not work with this connection", so it looks like it use the video standard :D

Finaly, I hope you are wrong about the ATA of 2004, and that my dealer is right about end of month ;)

[Robert Whitehead]

PoWeR-

The reason why the DVB318 will not work with some (if not all) HD PC monitors is that they are not HDCP compliant. Why would they be? They're for computers.

As far as the DVI Video Standard vs. PC Standard goes, just as the PC Standard Samsung 931 displays on DVI Video Standard displays, a DVI Video Standard DVD player would display on a PC Standard display (ignoring the HDCP issue).

Unfortunately, if Samsung is OEMing the Zenith DVB318 based on the HD931, it is unlikely that anything other than the feature package and case were changed, and it, too, will be PC Standard based.

I sincerely hope I am wrong.

Bob

[kevinca1]

Calling this a hd dvd player is wrong. IT IS NOT HD DVD.There are no hd dvd players that are ture hd.

[robert123]

Originally posted by Robert Whitehead

Unfortunately, if Samsung is OEMing the Zenith DVB318 based on the HD931, it is unlikely that anything other than the feature package and case were changed, and it, too, will be PC Standard based.

I sincerely hope I am wrong.

Bob

I see no reason to think that the Zenith is being OEMed by Samsung. The remote shown in the Zenith manual is exactly the same remote used for the Zenith DVB317. The menus look nothing alike, and (most importantly), the jack pack layout is completely different. That would require a redesign of the PCBs. Samsung (LGs Korean competitor) is probably the last company they would ever OEM something from. Zenith has been making DVD players for years, and has been incorporating DVI/HDCP in some products for over a year, so designing something like this should not be too hard for them.

Robert

[Po\/\/eR]

While we wait for the unit to show up, anyone would like to speculate on quality of:
- Build
- Loader
- Image (through DVI)
- Sound

To tell you the truth, I am bit concern about Zenith/LG product, especialy Zenith.

[Uther]

Is this really an HD player or is it a SCALING player that converts normal DVDs to 720p? The only HD players I have heard of on the horizon are the ones that will play WM9 HD content.

[robert123]

See the updated thread title.

Robert

[majozx3]

So are they shipping yet?

[arthurvino]

That is until Blue ray DVDs come out...
Yes, I wouldn't call this HD-DVD just yet.. There is only one on the market right now, sold in Japan, VERY expensive... and no media that I know of available..

Originally posted by kevinca1
Calling this a hd dvd player is wrong. IT IS NOT HD DVD.There are no hd dvd players that are ture hd.

[Po\/\/eR]

My dealer just told me that they have been delay 2 weeks, so mid December :(

Let hope that the final delivery date...

[robert123]

ETA 1/15/04

Robert

[applejack]

still no info on this player?

[zoro]

must be better option than LG

[Robert Whitehead]

Look at the thread on the LG DVI player as it appears to be the same as the DVB318, except for Canada. At CES, the DVB318 was displayed w/a card saying it used Faroudja, with a proj. release date of 1stQ04.

Since the Can. version is out, I would think the DVB318 should be out shortly. It may be delayed as LG is working on a software fix for some problems w/the Can. version and DVI.

Except for the problems, from the info in the thread, it sounds like an excellent choice for those who want DVI and scaling, but don't care about DVD-A and SACD.

[Todd_N]

I just read through the owners manual pdf file for the DVB318 and it states that 480i isnt available with the component outs (page 10). Since I see no scaling capabilities for non-anamorphic discs listed (like the panny RP91), I am assuming that if we have a TV that locks in full mode when a progressive signal is recieved that we would have to switch to S-Video if we want to be able to view non-anamorphic discs and 4:3 material correctly? If so that rules this player out for me. Don't these companies know that scaling like the RP91 is in demand?

[Ricker]

Does anyone have any info on the quality of the component and DVI outputs? The quality of the MPEG decoder (no chrome bug)?

[odinala]

This thing is supposedly released according to LG; anyone find one of these yet?

[zoro]

check with zenith usa

[panjj]

I looked at this unit on the zenith page and it indicated only component out--can you direct me to any site showing DVI out? Thanks.

[seattlephi]

I called a local vendor who called his distributor regarding the DVB318. He mentioned that the regional distribution center doesn't have these yet, and aren't in the computer yet. The regional manager told him that they don't know when the DVB318 will be released, or if there will be further changes to the player (which they say happens- Zenith tends to jump the gun on the website...) before it is released. They didn't have an ETA on the release either so no help yet....

Maybe I'll have to drive up to Canada for the LG 7832. Also it seems that the LG outputs 1080i over component even on copy-protected DVD's- at least that's what I saw in the thread? Even though the manuals are the same and both mention that 1080i may be put back to 480p over component without HDCP...

I guess it may not be a big deal since I own an X1 and it would descale the 1080i, but it seems like a good option since the good ol' panny aren't available, I'm not spending $300 for a v880 (or more for a denon 2200), the 563A, Q50, etc. don't seem to be great solutions with various problems...

If the Zenith/LG have faroudja, a good mpeg decoder, good build quality - and around $200 I'm sold...

[odinala]

zoro,
Zenith USA website gives a number of online outlets and vendors in my location that supposedly carry this model, however, after contacting all vendors and online outlets I've come up a big fat zero.

panji,
At http://us.lgservice.com you can download the DVB318 owners manual, it shows DVI connection and also lists a DVI cable in accessories supplied.

[panjj]

Thanks for the reference on LG. However, I did print the pdf on the unit from Zenith's site and it does not indicate DVI, only component. ???

[odinala]

panji,
Again, go to the us.lgservice.com website, click on owners manual, then input DVB318, you will then be able to download the Zenith DVB318 manual. Although it is the LG website, remember Zenith is now a LG brand.

[panjj]

Not to sound like a pest but I just went to the LG site and when you attempt to download the manual for the 318 it says the pdf file is no longer availale. Who knows?

[Kenni_o]

Originally posted by panjj
Not to sound like a pest but I just went to the LG site and when you attempt to download the manual for the 318 it says the pdf file is no longer availale. Who knows?

It downloaded late yesterday. Maybe their server was too busy?

[odinala]

Got the following reply from LG/Zenith today:

"Dear Customer, Thank you for inquiring with LG/Zenith Electronics. Your e-mail regarding the DVB318 has been received. The DVB318 has already been released. If you can't find at either one of those locations try checking Best Buy. If you can't find any there you may want to try checking with a local dealer in or in the surrounding area. Feel free to contact us in the future if you have any additional questions or concerns. Thank you again for contacting LG/Zenith

Contacted BB, of course they don't have it, nor is it listed in their inventory for ordering.

[odinala]

Does anyone have this player yet, if so where did you buy?

[ewclam9]

This is why LG/Zenith DVD player sales are so low. They can't even tell if they are selling a product or not. Everyone there is rocket scientist.

[jvlgato]

Same experience as above via Zenith web site. I emailed them and got the following response:

-----------Reply to Customer Enquiry ------------
Great Company, Great People Dear John, Thank you for inquiring of LG Electronics. Your e-mail has been received. The DVB 318 should be available sometime within the next 2 months. It does have a DVI-D digit out jack for connection to a television with a DVI connector. Please feel free to contact us if you have any additional questions or concerns. Thank you again for contacting LG Electronics. "Think the Best and One Team Spirit" = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Ian E-mail Administrator Customer Interactive Center LGEAI

[zoro]

This seems TO THE POINT reply imho..

[Robert Whitehead]

So, depending on who is writing the emails at LG, the 318 is available now, at the end of Feb., or in two months. LG should get its act together. Dare I say, VAPORWARE?

[applejack]

From LG:

Thank you for your inquiry to LG Electronics. Your email regarding the DVB318 has been received.

This DVD player does have a DVI-D output. As to when this unit will be available, I cannot give a specific date, for we do not receive it. To purchase the item, I can reccomend that you check with Best Buy, they carry many LG products. You can also check on our website, lgservice.com, and click on the 'where to buy' icon, enter the product and your zip code, and it will give you information on dealers in your area. Unfortunately, there is no way for us to know who may carry this specific model, you will have to check with the individual dealers.

Thank you again for contacting LG Electronics. Please feel free to contact us if you have further questions or concerns.

Think the Best and One Team Spirit

[Q of BanditZ]

This will be an excellent DVD player methinks.

Today is Feb. 27 and the Zenith dealership tells me that in the next week or two they should take delivery of them.

That DVI output really has me excited. I just purchased and received the Zenith c32v37 today, so it'll be a nice match.

I am really impressed with the return to form of Zenith's quality and prices for that quality. Impressive!

[robert123]

I was told a day or two ago that the DVB318 is available now.

Robert

[Q of BanditZ]

My dealer just got the price on it, so that means this thing's arrival is imminent. :)

[JimSD]

Are you guys hearing that from small local dealers, Circuit City? Zenith/LG emailed me earlier in the week and said it hadn't been released yet and they had no availability or pricing info on it. I sure hope what you're hearing is correct.

[Q of BanditZ]

Yes, I heard my info from a local, authorized, family own Zenith dealership that has been in business for 50 years. I expect him to be on the money. ;)

[cinemagotham]

Hey Q.

This Zenith spec page (http://www.zenith.com/sub_prod/product_Display.asp?cat=15&id=178) doesn't say anything about DVI. But I suspect the page is wrong.

[cinemagotham]

Wait a minute! What the heck is this? http://www.circuitcity.com/display_review.jsp?c=1&b=g&OID=71512&catoid=-8039

Circuit City lists the player at a ridiculously low price, has 66 user reviews (!), and shows images of a player without DVI or optical audio out! Is Zenith recycling model numbers or is CC confused as all get out?

[statman]

Originally posted by cinemagotham
Wait a minute! What the heck is this? http://www.circuitcity.com/display_review.jsp?c=1&b=g&OID=71512&catoid=-8039

Circuit City lists the player at a ridiculously low price, has 66 user reviews (!), and shows images of a player without DVI or optical audio out! Is Zenith recycling model numbers or is CC confused as all get out?

That's a DVB312, not a DVB318.

[andrew jc]

Relax it's the 312 not the 318. I'll be looking tomorrow and Sunday for this and the new Tosh player.

[cinemagotham]

Heh heh. I knew that. Carry on.

[cinemagotham]

Here's another question (hopefully not as dumb): On the user manual I found the following info:

"The selected resolution and ouput resolution may be
different during palying back a DVD which copy protection
signals are recorded. e.g., The ouput resolution is changed to 480p automatically even though the selected resolution is 1080i."

Shocking! (And I'm not just talking about their spelling!) What type of copy protection are they talking about? Will we discover that most commercial DVDs do not output in 1080i even if that's what you select?

[djmiked]

Correct. You need HDCP compatible to upconvert. I have the LG 3510A and using DVI, the DVD player will upconvert to either 720p or 1080i. When i hook up the component cables and run the DVD player that way, it will not upconvert. It locks in at 480p, even if I select 1080i or 720p on the player.

[cinemagotham]

But over DVI/HDCP all commercial DVDs will upconvert, correct? That's what I;m concerned about.

[merc]

Correct. You need HDCP compatible to upconvert.Well, if that is the case, we Americans are getting hosed. The Canadian clone to the DVB318 is the LG 7832 and it provides full time, all the time, 1080i DVD upconversion via its' component outputs.

It figures that the hollywood/DVD consortium cabal would screw us Americians.
Be American, Buy Canadian... or Buy Chinese?

[mrmurdstone]

DJMike implies that he actually has the DVB318 and has tried it out.

I thought it hasn't been released into the public channel yet?

I will not take anyone's word on the lack of 1080i upconvert over component until I read some other reviews.

Also, realize that these players are the same as the LG model released in Canada. That player has no component upconvert restrictions.

If this player is unable to upconvert over component I think it will be a firmware issue that will be cured with a hack or secret code like the LiteOn 2010.

[JimSD]

DJMike said he has the LG LST-3510A and I believe he's referring to that model in his post. The 3510A is not the model that is released in Canada, it's a combo HDTV receiver/DVD player that does upconversion for DVDs.

[mrmurdstone]

JimSD and DJMiked I stand corrected on the model number.

However, as this thread shows: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=348481&perpage=20&highlight=zenith&pagenumber=18 the Canadian version of the DVB318 (the LGDV 7832NXC) will, in fact, upconvert copy protected DVD's to 1080i over component.

I have no reason to think the Zenith player will be any different.

[djmiked]

The original LG 3510A did in fact upconvert through component. The newer ones do not. LG had a firmware fix for some reset issues and this "fix", changed the upconvert of component. You can only upconvert over DVI on this unit. I hope the Zenith unit upconverts over component, but I won't hold my breath. Right now to me it doesn't matter because I am using DVI, but it makes me mad that if I use the player on a tv with no DVI, I cannot upconvert.

[psklenar]

hmmm ... interesting. Neither the Zenith web page and product brochure indicate the existance of a DVI port and do specify upconversion to 1080i over the Component outputs. THis is why I'm so interested in it since my TV doesn't have a DVI port but does have two sets of 1080i Component inputs (my Motorola DTC6200 HD cable box in on one set now)

Zenith Product Page: http://www.zenith.com/sub_prod/product_Display.asp?cat=15&id=178

Zenith Product Brochure:
http://www.zenith.com/sub_prod/downloads_pdf/DVB318.pdf

[merc]

I can see a flood of returns of this DVD player if it does not upconvert via component outputs for all DVD playback. If it says so on the website, then it is true... or, it is false and misleading advertising and is subject to lawsuit too?

I'm gonna buy one based on what Zenith's web site said.... then we'll see. ;)

[cinemagotham]

Originally posted by merc
I'm gonna buy one based on what Zenith's web site said.... then we'll see. ;)

Ah, but where are you gonna buy one? If they change the specs any time before release then then there's not much you can say.

[mrmurdstone]

I just checked with a sales contact I have at Wild West Electronics (http://www.wildwestelectronics.net/) and though it is not listed on their website, the Zenith DVB318 is available now for order. Price $199.98

I have not dealt with this store before, but they seem pretty nice on the phone (1-877-936-8494 Mon.-Fri. 9:00a-5p (MST) ). Ask for a salesperson named Doug and he will hook you up.

[Q of BanditZ]

Go to www.zenithservice.com and call up the DVB318. You can download a PDF of just about every Zenith product there is from there, and you will clearly see...the DVB318 does have a DVI output among other things.

I am expecting that phone call from my Zenith dealership any day now to pick this puppy up. Last week, it showed up on his price list for the first time, at just about $200. So...that's a very good sign that this thing is about to hit the streets.

Cinema is right: Something could change at the last minute, but let me tell you something interesting.

Page 2 of this thread: I describe a conversation I had with a super cool guy that I got on the phone from Zenith. He basically inferred to me, and even said outright on some things, that the DVB318 might be able to play things that aren't exactly advertised. This was in reference to an SACD and DVD-a line of questioning.

He also was saying that the upconverting should work with just about anything, but to avoid lawsuits, they have to say it has certain limitations, etc. So, you can count on that DVI output working, and the components, and you can probably count on 1080i and 720p with most of your DVD's if not all of them. That's the idea he gave me.

He also said that it would be firmware upgradeable at a latter date, should the option be necessary or "something comes up."

;)

[cinemagotham]

Interesting...

[zoro]

Zenith is not the only one samsung tookaway DVD audio, before 931 came out, panasonic, took away DCDI from 97A, so any thing is possible?

[merc]

Ah, but where are you gonna buy one? If they change the specs any time before release then then there's not much you can say.Don't worry. I'll make sure I fully document Zenith's claims on the unit before I buy it. That documentation will include actually talking with a Zenith representative and the dealer I'm buying it from on the phone before I buy it that day. I'll also of course, download and print the data sheet from the Zenith site that same day. If any of those three sources says anything but YES, it will output upconverted HD DVD output via component outputs ALL the time, I won't be buying it and I'll tell everyone here what I found out.

Then, I guess I'll have to beg some Canadian dealer to sell me one here in the US.

[Q of BanditZ]

We will eagerly await your feedback. ;)

[merc]

We will eagerly await your feedback. BTW, your LG dealer in Lima is the only dealer I've found so far who says the 318 is available. Still, even from him it is a special order item.

[lachris]

The owner's manual seems to imply that you can change the country code back and forth, thus making this DVD player region free. Can anyone verify this?

[zoro]

yes, if they have zenith player lol?

[JimSD]

After reading the post from mrmurdstone above I emailed Wild West Electronics and was told that the DVB318s "are available now". Anybody ordered one from there yet?

[Q of BanditZ]

Heh. I wonder if my dealer has gotten any yet? I have two on special order (one for me, one for my sister) so hopefully...soon!

[mrmurdstone]

JimSD: Yep. I put my money where my mouth is and ordered one today from Wild West.

Free shipping and should be here late this week or early next. I will keep the forum informed of my experiences with this player.

[Q of BanditZ]

I am most eager to start hearing hard info about this!

[merc]

Anyone know what MPEG decoder and deinterlacing chipset is used in the DVB318?

[Apostate]

Well, LG version has Faroudja FLI2310 chipset which does both deinterlacing and scaling. Don't know about MPEG decoder though.

[dvdguru]

Anyone know if it has an HDMI output?

[JimSD]

It has DVI output, not HDMI according to the beta testers, er, Canadians who have the twin LG DV-7832.

[Rudy1]

Wouldn't multichannel analog outputs be necessary on the player in order for it to play back SACDs and DVD-Audio discs? According to the pictures in the manual, there are no multichannel analog outputs....

[Ricker]

Rudy1,
You don't need multichannel output though it would sound better. You can do it just like current DVD players do to Dolby Digital 5.1, downmix it to stereo (or Dolby Prologic encoded stereo).

[BillP]

My understanding is that this unit does not play SACD or DVD-A.

[Jim McC]

Is there any way they're just taking "pre-orders" for a list?

[Rudy1]

Originally posted by BillP
My understanding is that this unit does not play SACD or DVD-A.

That's what I thought, BillP....I remember the original specs from CES 2003 mentioned SACD & DVD Audio capability for this particular model, and I also read the same thing in subsequent press releases. But about 3 or 4 months ago, all mention of SACD & DVD Audio mysteriously disappeared from the specs.

Last night I read the user's manuals for both the Canadian and the US versions of this player, and I noticed that the blurb about the player not being able to scale some DVDs to 720p/1080i only appears in the manual for the Canadian version...I couln't find the same verbage in the US version's manual. It will be interesting to see if the US version has unrestricted scaling capabilities like the Canadian model does.

[BillP]

I am definitely going to get one of these new DVI/HDMI players for my Samsung DLP, but will wait till the dust settles and for comparisons to be posted in the forum. I'm currently leaning toward the new Samsung or Sony since they will both play SACD, although they will not be out for a few more months.

[JimSD]

mrmurdstone, have you got a tracking number or shipping notice yet?

[mrmurdstone]

JimSD:

No shipping tracking number yet. I have received an invoice from Wild West so the order has been placed with Zenith. Apparently WW places the order with Zenith and then they (Zenith) ship it from their warehouse to me directly.

Should be in next week. I'll post with any updates.

[zoro]

kool..lol factory direct!

[psklenar]

also known as a drop shipment.

[cinemagotham]

The downside to that is that they can't cofirm whether or not the actual packaging claims things like 1080i through component. WWWE just sent me the following email:
It does have 1080i output through the component output according to the Zenith info we have.

which is presumably the same PDF info that we've already seen... Hmmm...

[Q of BanditZ]

Supposedly it does not, but the Zenith guy that I talked to a few weeks ago (see earlier in this thread) basically was dropping me hints that this player might do things that are not advertised. He also alluded to firmware updates and getting around some legalities.

Interesting: People who reviewed the DVb312 unit on Amazon and Circuit City, some of them suggested that it, too, had an extra bonus or two that they weren't counting on.

I'll go in assuming that both these standards are not playable and maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised.

I am not sure why Zenith suddenly abandoned the universal player idea, as this unit was supposed to have been one of several universal players they were putting out this year...

[cinemagotham]

SUpposedly does not what? Play 1080i over component? Then no sale.

[RAVEN56706]

is it available to purchase now?

[jbrownin]

As this player is generally believed to be a re-badged LG DV7832, it then likely will have 1080i out thru component. The more pressing question is whether macrovision has been enabled for the U.S. and whether it can be hacked/ disabled

jjb

[JimSD]

I sent this email to Zenith yesterday:

"Is the DVB318 now available? At least one etailer says they are available and are taking orders, but I haven't seen them anywhere else. Do you have any idea when they will start showing up in stores such as Circuit City which is the only dealer in my area? Also, can you confirm that it outputs 1080i via the component output? Finally, can you confirm that it has a DVI output? "

This is the reply I got today:

"The DVB318 has been released. I cannot speculate as to when Circuit City may carry this unit. It does output 1080i and it does also include DVI output. "

[cinemagotham]

That's weird. If a DVD player is released and nobody stocks it, was it really released? A truly philosophical question...

With any luck Best Buy will stock it at the same time that they send me my $150 in gift cards or whatever it comes out to from buying my HDTV.

[Q of BanditZ]

Yeah, Monday I am calling my dealer and see what he knows.

This unit will do everything over component the same as DVI. 1080i, whatever you want. Neither connection got short changed.

[Rudy1]

On Friday I called LG customer service to ask about this, and I was given a number for LG technical support; the gentleman I spoke to was shocked to learn he was speaking to a mere consumer....he thought at first that I was a dealer. He would not speak about features, so I asked if the DVB318 had the same Faroudja chipset as the Canadian version, and he said it did as it was "made by the same manufacturer". It remains to be seen whether or not the ability to output 720p & 1080i over component has been disabled for the American version of the player.

[Q of BanditZ]

... anything yet?

[merc]

Has anyone had their credit cards charged yet for payment of this phantom player?

[Q of BanditZ]

LOL!

[E Jackson]

This has got to be the screwiest thread I've ever read.

After all the speculation (especially by people at the manufacturer), I'm not really sure I want one. Perhaps a fellow AVS Canuck can make a few bucks and organize a group buy. Are the LG's region 1?

Just wondering...

[plm]

Hi,

I bought the LG-DV7832 in Canada about two months ago. The major problem was the "white crush" through DVI. Up-conversion (720p,1080i) worked perfectly fine through both component and DVI connection in watching all my DVD collections. In 1080i mode, the PQ was very details and sharp, especially using DVI. I returned it because of the really bad "white crush" problem. I will definitely buy it again once LG fix the problem(s). For $199, it is a pretty good buy. If the Zenith version is exactly same as the LG one (unrestricted up-conversion through component), I don?t see any reason why not give it a try.

LG may be working on the problem(s), causing the delay.

plm.

[jvlgato]

plm, What's white crush? I've heard of black crush, but not white crush. Was this only in particular modes and/or outputs, or all the time?

[Q of BanditZ]

Heh. I have heard of these things, but what are both? ;)

[plm]

Hi,

Since I am not an expert, I try to explain it in simple term. “White crush” means lack of detail in bright object, no matter how you adjust the contrast. “Black crash” is the other way, no detail in dark object. When I put up the DVE grayscale ramp, the highest three IREs (80%,90%,100%) were all merged together. It happened to all modes through DVI connection. Component connection worked perfectly fine without this problem.

plm.

[Zoma121]

I'm glad I stumbled on this thread. I'm getting a Zenith 32V37 in about a month, along with speakers, etc. People keep recommending the Denon 910 as a better DVD player than PS2 (which I'd have to buy proprietary component cables for). But I happen to have a spare DVI-D cable handy, which would be better than going out and getting some more component cables.

[cinemagotham]

For the record I bought the Mad Catz component cable for the PS2 for only $10 (versus $60 for Monster PS2 component cables) and they look very nice. However, PS2 is a lousy permanent DVD player. You'll definitely want to check out an additional option.

[JimSD]

Zoma121, the Denon 910 does not pass below black (effectively black crush) via component. See some other threads here about that.

[Zoma121]

I'm not at the point where I really care about passing below black, I'm just wondering what I'm getting by going out and spending $200 to replace my PS2. If the Zenith looks a lot better and can use a DVI-D and can do 1080i, I'll probably get it. What I'm wondering is whether the Denon 910 at $230 is better than the Zenith using DVI at $200. I'd also have to buy the component cables for the Denon.

[plm]

BTW, the LG-DV7832 comes with all types of cable, including component and DVI-D. It passed below blacks through DVI or component.

[djtrev25]

Is the DVB318 DVD Player Available yet. This is the craziest forum I have read. I saw the DVB318 at 2004 CES in the LG/Zenith Booth. I was the only person who seemed to even know it existed at the booth. It was a working unit but not hooked up to anything. There was no DVI output just component. I have a DreamX so was familiar with the upscaleing chipsets out there. I asked the LG People and a Zenith rep and they were stunned to find out that it would upconvert to 1080I. Before I new it they had 10 employies looking at the player wondering where it came from. I had to laugh. Nobody had any information about the unit. The manufacturer date was afew days prior to CES. It also has a display screen that is common of other OEM Manufactures. I have a feeling that it is a rebadged product like a dreamX or Liteon. I also assume it uses the Sigma design chip only because they would most likely label it with the faroudja logo for as a sales point. I hope I am not right. It would be great to get a great cheap player that has a solid firmware that outputs 1080I through component and dvi. Keep up the good work...

[merc]

DVB318 = vaporware....

DV7832 = vaporware in the US

US Consumers = Screwed

[JimSD]

Patience, patience. I'm sure it takes a little time for it to make its way through the distribution channels. Hopefully mrmurdstone's arrives this week and he can tell us all about it.

[cinemagotham]

From this thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=388512)

April 8, 2004 - I just got off the line with Zenith customer service. I asked if the DVB318 was available and if not-when it would be available. They ... said the unit was due out in 1 to 1-1/2 months. It will be available at CC and BB.

So, take that with a grain of salt.

[Q of BanditZ]

Originally posted by merc
DVB318 = vaporware....

Feels like it almost.



DV7832 = vaporware in the US

? Never heard of this. More info please?



US Consumers = Screwed

Heh. LOL.

This 4-6 weeks news from Zenith supposedly (I have no reason to disbelive that) displeases me. This means I have no DVD until then. It also means they are going to be putting that unit up against Sony and a bunch of other new units. This could get very interesting...

[Q of BanditZ]

Originally posted by cinemagotham
From this thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=388512)



So, take that with a grain of salt.

???

They usually have been pretty accurate when I have talked to them. That's not where the information problem was coming from. We just had some misinformation around here from one or two people.

As it is, that date disappoints me greatly if that holds.

[JimSD]

Haha, now I'm beginning to believe the vaporware thing. Here's what they told me last week:

-----------Reply to Customer Enquiry ------------
Great Company, Great People Dear Jim, Thank you for inquiring of LG Electronics. Your e-mail has been received. The DVB318 has been released. I cannot speculate as to when Circuit City may carry this unit. It does output 1080i and it does also include DVI output. Please feel free to contact us if you have any additional questions or concerns. Thank you again for contacting LG Electronics. "Think the Best and One Team Spirit" = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Kim E-mail Administrator Customer Interactive Center LGEAI

I have a feeling they will be too late to the party for me. The Yamaha S1500 is looking to be the more likely contender for me at this point.

[Q of BanditZ]

Just called Zenith. Confirmed. They told me 4-6 weeks on the DVB318.

I may or may not wait it out. I figured, I haven't had a DVD player for a couple of months or so, what's one more, but, if I see something better in that time frame show up, I will jump on it.

I need to look into this Yamaha unit...

[cinemagotham]

Originally posted by Q of BanditZ
???

I wasn't calling them liars, but they are obviously confused about this item. It seems it's either (1) out already (2) coming out in 1 - 1 1/2 months (3) something else.

We'll see.

[Q of BanditZ]

Originally posted by cinemagotham
I wasn't calling them liars, but they are obviously confused about this item. It seems it's either (1) out already (2) coming out in 1 - 1 1/2 months (3) something else.

We'll see.

You can see what I just wrote. They told me number two. Coin toss, I guess.

Best thing I can do is what's been done: I am down for an order at my dealer, and he'll call me the second one comes in. :)

[psklenar]

What are the other options for 1080i over component here in the USA over the short term? Just the Momitsu and the Norcent? Is there anything else?

I've been very interested in this Zenith for my bedroom since a 26" widescreen HDTV just took up residence on the chest of drawers recently. It doesn't have a DVI port, just a pair of 1080i component inputs.

Thanks,

[merc]

It seems it's either (1) out already (2) coming out in 1 - 1 1/2 months (3) something else.I'd bet the correct answer is 1, 2, and 3. I'd bet it was released for sale(1), but then the Hollywood/DVD consortium got a whiff of the 1080i via component and sent a legal letter to LG, thereby putting a hold on the unit until the firmware could be altered on all of the US units to stop the 1080i output via component on macrovision enabled DVDs(2). Finally, (3) is also correct since the unit that we eventually get will be something else besides the DVB318 as touted on the Samsung site.

Anyone want to place a wager on this??? ;) :(

[Q of BanditZ]

Well ,we jinxed it. Congratulations gang!

I just got a call from my dealer today and he says that he's got his price sheet for $189.99 and he's placed me down for one and I should expect it within the next couple of weeks.

These babys are officially "Go!"

[merc]

Q,

Did your dealer verify that the players still support 1080i output via component for ALL DVDs, like the Canadian 7832?

Will he give you your money back if it doesn't do that?

Finally, I spoke with the only authorized LG dealer in Lima a few weeks ago, and although they had it on their price sheet and would order it for me, they still didn't know how long it would take before I'd get it. Did your dealer absolutely verify with LG that you'd have it within two weeks?

[brightbulb]

My dealer gave me the local distributor's number so I called.

He said, "Zenith is notorious for putting stuff on the books way in advance of a release." He said there is no info on this player coming his way anytime soon.

Can we Americans buy the LG version? Point me in the right direction please!

[Rudy1]

Originally posted by brightbulb
My dealer gave me the local distributor's number so I called.

He said, "Zenith is notorious for putting stuff on the books way in advance of a release." He said there is no info on this player coming his way anytime soon.

Can we Americans buy the LG version? Point me in the right direction please!

I have contacted several LG dealers in Canada, and none of them was interested in selling to US customers.

[brightbulb]

Any good websites?

[Q of BanditZ]

My dealer will let me do whatever I want. If I am dissatisifed, I can exchange, refund, whatever it takes.

To the best of my knowledge, the DVD player still has the DVI output and both it and component will upconvert to 1080i.

Remember, a few pages back what I wrote about that one conversation? Zenith is not going to officially advertise that this thing upconverts ALL DVD's, but this guy strongly encouraged me and dropped me a boat load of hints that I wouldnt' be disappointed and that I should experiment.

He also said some firmware might float around sometime after the player has been out for a little while.

So, I feel fairly confident about this. We'll see soon enough... ;)

[Rudy1]

Originally posted by brightbulb
Any good websites?

The only dealer that consistently seems to have the LG-DV7832 in stock is:

http://www.2001audiovideo.com/index2.html

Maybe if somebody called and explained to them that they could probably sell a couple dozen units an hour to US customers they might change their minds. This deck has gotten rave reviews from Canadian owners.

[brightbulb]

Yes, but when....
Until I can stick a DVD in it -i t doesn't upconvert nothin'

[cinemagotham]

Originally posted by Rudy1
The only dealer that consistently seems to have the LG-DV7832 in stock is:

http://www.2001audiovideo.com/index2.html

Maybe if somebody called and explained to them that they could probably sell a couple dozen units an hour to US customers they might change their minds. This deck has gotten rave reviews from Canadian owners.

I can't say they would or wouldn't but when I asked them if I could buy one they said no.

[merc]

I can't say they would or wouldn't but when I asked them if I could buy one they said no.When I called, I got the same answer. The guy suggested I get a Canadian friend to buy one for me and have him ship it to me.... :(

[EchoBaseGeek]

They have a store in NY looks like from their website.

[cinemagotham]

Originally posted by EchoBaseGeek
They have a store in NY looks like from their website.

If by NY you mean North York!
;)

[EchoBaseGeek]

and now is the part where i bang my head against the wall going.....duh...

[cinemagotham]

Hey, you weren't technically WRONG. :D

[Q of BanditZ]

Heh. Patience my friends...patience.... ;)

[mrmurdstone]

I have finally obtained a tracking number on this puppy. Arrival time is Wednesday 4/14. I'll let you know what the scoop with this player is then.

[brightbulb]

Did you get it from your local Rep?

[mrmurdstone]

Brightbulb:

Nope. www.wildwestelectronics.net

[sknight1]

mrmurdstone:

I only see the 317 and the 352 as being available...

[cinemagotham]

Originally posted by sknight1
mrmurdstone:

I only see the 317 and the 352 as being available...

You have to call them.

I'm psyched to see what mrmurdstone thinks. For the record, what previous player(s) will you be comparing too? Ahd what's the rest of your system consist of?

[Q of BanditZ]

Wow, that soon?! I am eager to hear what mrstone says, too!

I should be getting mine pretty soon as well...

[mrmurdstone]

Cinemagotham:

I will be comparing the Zenith dvb318 to my Panasonic RP91 which should be a pretty good matchup.

The rest of my system consists
of:

Television = Mits. WT-46809
Sat. Reciever = Directv Phillips DVR
Receiver = Denon 3803
DVD = Panasonic RP91 (v259 firmware update)
Power = Tice Elite 4 power conditioner
Speakers= Def Tech BP8(b) fronts, Mission 77c1 center, Mission 77ds surrounds
Subwoofer= HSU VTF-3
Interconnects = Canare Component, Monster THX Ultra Component (surprisingly good), Canare Star Quad Speaker wire, Better Jeans Digital Coax, Toslink, Monster THX Ultra S-Video

Also, I called Wild West and asked about the delay in shipment and they said Zenith did an end of the month inventory and was in the process of allocating (their words, not mine) dvb318's to dealers when my order came in.

[Q of BanditZ]

Yes, that's correct. My dealer told me the same thing. I am looking forward to it!

[CrazyINP]

My local dealer has it in stock
I am going to pick it up, the price is $199.99
I will let you know tonight if is real, I asked them 3 times and they said they have it

[sknight1]

For clarification does the 318 have a DVI out or not? The two page brochure from the Zenith web-site makes no mention of it, but the user's manual from the LG web-site shows that the player does have the port. I'm feeling a bit confused here.

[brightbulb]

Just FYI I emailed Wild West

"Thank you for your inquiry. These are available and we ship direct from Zenith to you. Have a super day.

Sincerely,


Douglas E. Gillis, "Wild West Electronics, Inc."
820 East Van Buren Street #116
Goodyear, AZ 85338
Office (623) 215-2004 ext. 101 / FAX (602)532-7624

Regular Office Hours:

Monday - Friday 9a-5p MST (West Coast Time)

Closed all weekend's and holiday's

question: if you play a full screen DVD on the 1080i do you get full screen or to you get 16:9 because it is 1080i? I like to fill up my 8x6 screen.

[CrazyINP]

Here you go guys,
I just got it, I am going to connect it as soon as I press the enter :)))
Check out the pics. it does come with DVI cable and output of course
I can't believe I didn't call earlier that local dealer has it for the past 10 days, damn . check the pics with the date the player was shipped to them
03/30/04

I will let you know how is the pics, I can only compare it with my old F85S with Progressive scan


Well my web server is down somehow,
so I will need to post them one by one if some of the mods can host them for me and delete the other posts

THanks

[CrazyINP]

2nd

[CrazyINP]

3rd

[CrazyINP]

4th

[CrazyINP]

last

[brightbulb]

It says dvb318 on the box! Yahoooo and my what lovely hands you have Mrs Clever.

[brightbulb]

please tell please tell what is the picture like???

how sucky is the remote.

[domino2332]

If anyone gets this player and has the Z2 please tell how it performs...I read that the LG sold in Canada was not compatible with the Z2...

[Sam S]

Originally posted by CrazyINP
Here you go guys,
I just got it, I am going to connect it as soon as I press the enter :)))


Cool!

Does it use the Faroudja deinterlacer? How does it handle 4:3 discs?

[CrazyINP]

Ok the only movie I have on both formats are RONIN,
here is the first pic in 4:3 format and second post will be the same movie but 16:9 almost at same scene, I am not sure how good will come out the pics. but I think is really good, and if someone explain what is Z2 I can try it.

Ahhhh by the way it does play MP3 on DVD and all my DVD-Rs I made.

[CrazyINP]

16:9 same movie almost at the same time

[Sam S]

Originally posted by CrazyINP
Ok the only movie I have on both formats are RONIN,
here is the first pic in 4:3 format and second post will be the same movie but 16:9 almost at same scene,

OK, so it will not let you adjust the 4:3 picture in any way, i.e. add black bars to the side, or crop the top and bottom? Maybe try the Zoom button on the remote?

I forget how to tell on Sony TVs what the input format is (480i/480p/720p/1080i). Can you verify what the player is putting out via component by cycling through the output resolution button on the front panel?

[Rudy1]

Most TVs lock into FULL mode when receiving a 720p or 1080i signal. I hope it does output 1080i over component.

[domino2332]

Sorry about the unclear Z2 comment...I was referring to anyone that has a Sanyo Z2 projector ...

[CrazyINP]

Ok,
1. you can't add black bars on 4:3, you can zoom it or makes it wider or taller but no bars.

2.I was able to change the upconfersion to 1080i on component but, the pics looks better then 480p for sure, but notes in the manual says that even the higher resolutation is selected if the DVD is copy protected will reduce to 480p automatically.


Originally posted by Sam Scamardo
OK, so it will not let you adjust the 4:3 picture in any way, i.e. add black bars to the side, or crop the top and bottom? Maybe try the Zoom button on the remote?

I forget how to tell on Sony TVs what the input format is (480i/480p/720p/1080i). Can you verify what the player is putting out via component by cycling through the output resolution button on the front panel?

[CrazyINP]

I gave my NEC 156 to a friend if I get soon I can test it. I am not sure what is the problem with Z2


Originally posted by domino2332
Sorry about the unclear Z2 comment...I was referring to anyone that has a Sanyo Z2 projector ...

[Sam S]

Originally posted by CrazyINP
Ok,
1. you can't add black bars on 4:3, you can zoom it or makes it wider or taller but no bars.


I'm still a little confused on the Zoom feature. Can you take that 4:3 Ronin image and "Zoom" it to be the correct proportions on your 16:9 screen? Obviously the sides would be cropped because that's the way it was encoded on the disc, but will "Zoom" crop off the top and put everyone back in normal proportions?

[CrazyINP]

when I am connected with DVI my tv is locked on FULL and with the zoom I can't but the bars back.

Originally posted by Sam Scamardo
I'm still a little confused on the Zoom feature. Can you take that 4:3 Ronin image and "Zoom" it to be the correct proportions on your 16:9 screen? Obviously the sides would be cropped because that's the way it was encoded on the disc, but will "Zoom" crop off the top and put everyone back in normal proportions?

[Sam S]

So Zoom won't work with DVI?

[CrazyINP]

You can't make it smaller then the full screen, but you can zoom it, or make it wider or taller separate.

so if you want to watch 4:3 like a real 4:3 u can't or at least I can't make it.

Originally posted by Sam Scamardo
So Zoom won't work with DVI?

[plm]

CrazyINP,

I had the LG version DV7832 and returned it because of the "white crush" from IRE 80 to 100 when connected through DVI. Please put up the DVE greyscale ramp and check whether your Zenith player has the same problem or not. PQ through DVI was definitely better than component in both 720p and 1080i mode, except that nasty "white crush" problem. If they had resolved this problem, this player is a STEAL for just $199.

Thanks in advance,
plm.

[CrazyINP]

I am really new on this forum sorry but what DVE is, and I am pretty sure if LG has it Zenith will have it too. Mine said is build Dec.2003
So where can I get DVE from, is that on AVIA DVD.
I am placing order right now for one, if anyone local (Sunnyvale, CA or bay area) has it and let me borrow it I will test it.



Originally posted by plm
CrazyINP,

I had the LG version DV7832 and returned it because of the "white crush" from IRE 80 to 100. Please put up the DVE greyscale ramp and check whether your Zenith player has the same problem or not. PQ through DVI was definitely better than component in both 720p and 1080i mode, except that nasty "white crush" problem. If they had resolved this problem, this player is a STEAL for just $199.

Thanks in advance,
plm.

[plm]

First of all, thanks for you help.

DVE means Digital Video Essentials. It is quite similar to AVIA and is also for calibration purposes. You can just simply put up a bright scene; compare the details of a bright object using DVI and component. If the “white crush” exists, you won’t see any details at all. A good example is the blue fur of Sulley under bright light in Monster Inc.

plm.

[psklenar]

Where are folks finding this player? According to the Zenith web site, my only local option is Circuit City and their website doesn't list it as an option yet, at least as of this morning.

Thanks,

[merc]

I was able to change the upconfersion to 1080i on component but, the pics looks better then 480p for sure, but notes in the manual says that even the higher resolutation is selected if the DVD is copy protected will reduce to 480p automatically.Damnit! Can someone please verify that this player does downrez DVDs via its' component outputs.

I simply can't believe that Zenith would give Canadians 1080i via component on all DVDs, but screw us Americans??? I realize I told everyone that this would happen, but deep in my heart I hoped for better from Zenith. This is simply ridiculuous... :(

[mrmurdstone]

Crazy INP:

Have you tested a copy-protected disc yet to see if the player prevents upconverting through component?

Also, is there definite confirmation on the inclusion of Faroudja chipset in the 318?

[GePapa]

Does the LG(canada) downrez?

[cinemagotham]

I wonder how this player will work with a 4:3 HD tv. That's what I have (Q has the same set, so I guess I'll find out soon...)

[merc]

Does the LG(canada) downrez?Nope. It plays all DVDs, copyprotected or not, just fine in 1080i via its' component outputs...

Here's a review which says this: http://www.keohi.com/keohihdtv/experttips/michaeltlv/lg_dv7832_review.html

and

Here is the AVS thread where owners confirm this: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=348481&perpage=60&highlight=dv7832&pagenumber=1

[EchoBaseGeek]

any one figure out how to get a hold of the LG player?

[merc]

any one figure out how to get a hold of the LG player?The only way that I know of is to find someone in Canada to buy it and ship it to you. The dealers in Canada that I've contacted so far, won't ship it into the USA. :(

[EchoBaseGeek]

any one know of any shops in the windsor area? i feel a road trip coming on

[cinemagotham]

Originally posted by mrmurdstone
Crazy INP:Also, is there definite confirmation on the inclusion of Faroudja chipset in the 318?

This isn't "definite confirmation" necessarily but you can see the DCDi logo on the box in one of the photos INP posted. Now, does it work for both output? Who knows.

With the white line problem on the Zenith and the component not giving 1080i this is looking more and more like a DVI player for me.

[whsbuss]

Originally posted by merc
Damnit! Can someone please verify that this player does downrez DVDs via its' component outputs.

I simply can't believe that Zenith would give Canadians 1080i via component on all DVDs, but screw us Americans??? I realize I told everyone that this would happen, but deep in my heart I hoped for better from Zenith. This is simply ridiculuous... :(

Can someone post the manual? Gotta believe its mentioned in there.

[Q of BanditZ]

www.zenithservice.com

Download PDFs of all products there.

Remember guys: This DVB318 is supposed to be a very much fixed version of the spotty Canadian unit that's been out.

I don't understand why anyone would give a damn, legally, about upconverting or not. Who cares? Why should their be any limits whatsoever? It's not like you're reproducing something... I don't get what the hub ub is about it at all.

I was encouraged by several Zenith reps to experiment. I think they just have to state things to avoid a lawsuit. Although...who would sue them and why?

[cinemagotham]

Originally posted by whsbuss
Can someone post the manual? Gotta believe its mentioned in there.

Try this. (http://www.zenithservice.com/jsp/common/download.jsp?DOC_ID=ACOWM000033774&FILE_NAME=ACOWM000033774.pdf&FILE_GUBUN=I&ORIGINAL_NAME_b1_a1=DVB318_OM_0819.pdf)

[zoro]

LOL, player was hardly visible in those pics, it is soooo small...

[whsbuss]

cinemagotham,

thanks for the manual link. Nothing mentioned there about upconvert being disabled for protected DVDs.

[JimSD]

Someone mentioned about posting a pic of the gray scale test in DVE. Since you don't have that, do you have Finding Nemo? In the THX optimizer test the first one is a rectangle with 8 boxes that are different shades of white. I think if it's crushing whites you'll see one big white rectangle, not 8 squares of different shades. The THX optimizer is on the first disc, I think in the Setup area.

[cinemagotham]

Originally posted by whsbuss
cinemagotham,

thanks for the manual link. Nothing mentioned there about upconvert being disabled for protected DVDs.

It also doesn't seem to say anything about the faroudji (sp?) chip... Weird...

[cinemagotham]

The manual only mentions 1080i a couple times:

Tip: You can change the resolution
(480p, 720p, 1080i) for the component/
DVI-D video output by pressing
UPCONVERSION on the front panel.
480i is not available.


COMPONENT VIDEO OUT (Y) 1.0 V (p-p), 75 Ω, negative sync, RCA jack x 1
(Pb)/(Pr) 0.7 V (p-p), 75 Ω, RCA jack x 2 (480p, 720p, 1080i)
DVD-D DIGITAL OUT DVI-D Single Link connector x 1, (480p, 720p, 1080i)

[jbrownin]

The manual does, however, indicates that the unit has macrovision. All ire should be directed to the mpaa, which believes you the consumer dont have the right to view the material in higher- res thru component. I have hopes that this machine can be hacked, as its clone the DV7832 does not have mv enabled.

[merc]

Nothing mentioned there about upconvert being disabled for protected DVDs.whsbss,

CrazyINP, who has the DV318 in his house reported this:
I was able to change the upconfersion to 1080i on component but, the pics looks better then 480p for sure, but notes in the manual says that even the higher resolutation is selected if the DVD is copy protected will reduce to 480p automatically.

My guess is that the "notes" are on a seperate piece of paper stuck in the manual when Zenith made the firmware changes on the units they received from Asia. I'd guess that was why this unit was being reported as being available, but, was delayed... :(

Seems like the Hollywood Studios got to them and convinced them they should screw us here in the US.

BE AMERICAN, BUY CHINESE, OR AT LEAST CANADIAN. :(

[merc]

The other part to this sick conspiracy is that now I can't find any existance of the LG DV7832NXC DVD player on any LG site at all.... it has just mysteriously disappeared. If someone can find it or the manual for it on an LG site, please post it here.

Maybe, the studios have convinced LG to screw the Canadians as well? :rolleyes:

[cinemagotham]

This strikes me as a prime candidate for HKFlix to sell an "upgraded" version ;)

[zoro]

does momitsu uses dcdi

[brightbulb]

Excuse the rant here but.....
Why in the *&^ would I buy a new player that still only does 480p?
99.9% of the DVD's people watch are copyrighted.

What's the point if this unit can not he hacked? It is just another DVD player!

Ohh I forgot...I get to go buy another expensive component cable to get 480p! Sounds greaatttt!

If I rent a bus will people sign up for a trip to Canada? We will make two stops;
1. One for cheaper prescription drugs(you need them after dealing with HD in the USA.)
2. Electronics store for the LG player.

Any takers! Ah?

[cinemagotham]

It does supposedly still do the upscaling for DVI, so there's that, although if DVI does not allow the TV to use its zoom function I'll be SOL for my nonanamorphic widescreen DVDs (like Vertigo)

[merc]

It does supposedly still do the upscaling for DVIIf this unit is just a disabled version of the LG DV7832, it has already been reported that its' DVI output is nothing special.

It was the 1080i component output that made this unit special...

It is just inexcusable for the studio-manufacturer cabal to dis us like this? Us early adopters are the ones who keep them in business. :rolleyes:

Maybe, if they force us to buy our DVD players from China, we should buy our DVDs and music CDs from there too?

[cinemagotham]

I guess I can understand both sides of the story to a certain extent. I mean, they want control of their product, which they own. They don't want people making HD and near-HD quality masters of their stuff. But it is really aggravating. I was sold (well, almost sold, seeing as how I didn't buy) on the 1080i through component too. Maybe I need to just get a nice DCDi non-upscale player. It's not like the image will look BAD!

[p@55w0rd]

Maybe I missed something here but I have not seen a post the definitely confirms that the 318 does not up-convert through component. I mean an actual user results. In the LG version the same thing is in the manual and it still up-converts through the component output.

[cinemagotham]

Originally posted by Chuck Coughlin
Maybe I missed something here but I have not seen a post the definitely confirms that the 318 does not up-convert through component. I mean an actual user results. In the LG version the same thing is in the manual and it still up-converts through the component output.

Innnnteressssting....

How would you check? My TV gives info on source res but only through its QAM tuner, as far as I can tell... (Is that true, Q? I don't remember.)

[psklenar]

And the thing that made this so interesting is more and more units are doing upscaling over DVI ... but there are few who do it over Component ... and there are still a lot of HDTV's out there that have 1080i capable Component inputs but no DVI inputs (like ... most all HDTV's released more than a year ago ... like my brand new bedroom TV ... etc).

<sigh>

[whsbuss]

See, Hollywood just wants us to buy a HD-DVD copy of their crap. Then they can re-distribute the same movies we all have in HD format.

It absolutely make no sense.

[merc]

Maybe I missed something here but I have not seen a post the definitely confirms that the 318 does not up-convert through component. I mean an actual user results.Chuck,
Did the LG manual also say protected DVDs were downconverted? Can you point me to a link for the LG manual?

As much as I am praying that the Zenith version will upconvert like the LG one, previous history of disabled and discontinued units that did upconvert say otherwise.

Still, my fingers are crossed.

[whsbuss]

Originally posted by cinemagotham
Innnnteressssting....

How would you check? My TV gives info on source res but only through its QAM tuner, as far as I can tell... (Is that true, Q? I don't remember.)

I guess you could play a DVD, like LOTR, and press the upconvert button on the front panel to see if the output changes. My Sammy DLP interrupts the input with resolution changes. Of course, you always have the "objective eye" to visually compare.

[cinemagotham]

Yeah, my TV goes a little jig when it resets from 480p to 1080i but it would be nice to scientifically know if it's doing it or not...

[merc]

How would you check?On my 2 year old Pioneer HDTV(without DVI), if you push the button for the input which is receiving the signal from your DVD player, it shows the signal on the screen. If it is 480p it says 31K; if it is 1080i it says 33K.

[whsbuss]

Originally posted by merc
On my 2 year old Pioneer HDTV(without DVI), if you push the button for the input which is receiving the signal from your DVD player, it shows the signal on the screen. If it is 480p it says 31K; if it is 1080i it says 33K.

OK then. Can someone actually test this via component?

[psklenar]

Originally posted by merc
On my 2 year old Pioneer HDTV ... If it is 480p it says 31K; if it is 1080i it says 33K.

Gee, my 1yo Mitsu says "480P" and "1080I" when I press the "Info" button. :p

[whsbuss]

CrazyINP -

Can you set up your new unit via component and do a test? Play a copy-protected DVD and select the different upconvert formats from the front panel button.

[merc]

Gee, my 1yo Mitsu says "480P" and "1080I" when I press the "Info" button.Your Mits is obviously smarter than my Pioneer. :)

BTW, Hi Pat! Long time no see. :)

[merc]

Can you set up your new unit via component and do a test? Play a copy-protected DVD and select the different upconvert formats from the front panel button.But... don't select 720p unless you are sure your set can accept that mode. ;)

[psklenar]

Originally posted by merc
Your Mits is obviously smarter than my Pioneer. :) ...

well ... at least one year newer. ;)


...BTW, Hi Pat! Long time no see. :)

I've been lurking ... work's been keeping me busy ... like the coworker who's looking over my shoulder waiting for me to work with him now ... :)

later,

[Sam S]

Originally posted by cinemagotham
It does supposedly still do the upscaling for DVI, so there's that, although if DVI does not allow the TV to use its zoom function I'll be SOL for my nonanamorphic widescreen DVDs (like Vertigo)

This is the make or break feature IMO. If it (apparently DVB318 cannot) adjust aspect ratio for 4:3 disc @ 1080i either via component or DVI, then it would be a winner. Looks like Momitsu is still one of the affordable choices for this, but no Faroudja :(

[Cinemaphile]

It's been interesting following this thread with all the hand-wringing going on based on pure speculation about the Zenith. Based on my experience so far with the LG7832 (yes, I am one of those damn Canadians who has the player), I would recommend you guys to go ahead and get the Zenith. The LG manual says precisely what the Zenith manual says about copy protected DVDs being limited to 480p over component even though 1080i is selected on the player. I can confirm that this is not the case. Every DVD I have thrown into the LG is shown at 1080i on my LT150 projector (I can check the format of the input signal on the LT150). DVD playback is superb over component (no white crush issues or anything else for that matter - I have calibrated the player/projector with Avia).

So go and buy the Zenith - the DCDi works and it puts my Liteon 2001 to shame (no artificial halos)!

[whsbuss]

Cinemaphile-

We in the US hope this is true. That's why we want someone here how has the unit do a test via component.

[psklenar]

and I'd also like to know where folks are getting these here in the US. :) The only one I've heard named is Wild West Electronics, but it sounds like the other folks got theirs from local dealers??

The Zenith "find dealers" site just lists Circuit City for my area ... :(

[Paul Bigelow]

The manual states (480p/720p/1080i via component and DVI).

It does appear however that Faroudja processing is not being utilized....

I can see it... a low-cost upconverting player shootout!

[merc]

It does appear however that Faroudja processing is not being utilized....for DVI that is... ? Right? I think that in the situations where the image is produced by the MPEG decoder and then deinterlaced by the DCDi, the Faroujda was involved... then again, maybe I have this all backward?

Hello Stacy or Kris???? :)

[Q of BanditZ]

Or Dave?

Another curiosity that's come up in the Direct View forum, in regards to Zenith, is the literature for the smaller TV's, like the 27 inch HD's boast about a Faroudjia chip being on them, but it's not advertised on the bigger sets.

I was told from day on this DVD player was also going to have a Faroudjia chip. The stock on this goes down immediately if I find out otherwise.

Do keep in mind that Zenith's website, unforunteately, could afford to be kept a little more current and could use a few more details.

[merc]

Q,

Oh yes, Zenith definitely touted an onboard DCDi solution on board their new monitors....

[JonMarsh]

It's funny how many DVD's do have encryption, and also a number don't.

But my solution, which I already use with the MyHD board for DVD playback on my HTPC, is to rip the movie to it's basics, stripping the copy protection, then copying that over the network to the HTPC, or burning an unprotected DVD so I can watch the movie scaled up to 1080i.

No reason "re-authoring" the movie on your PC wouldn't solve this problem in most cases, especially since dual layer burners are coming out now.

Cumbersome? Yes, but where there's a will, there's usually, eventually, a way.

OTOH, if it will just upscale everything, that would be sweet.

~Jon

[merc]

Jon... I do this now, but for different reasons.

Do you think that Hollywood is trying to increase in home copying, by their restrictions on Americans?

[Cinemaphile]

DCDi is being utilized - no doubt about that - I have checked it with the waving flag test in Video Essentials. No jaggies.

[cinemagotham]

Originally posted by Cinemaphile
DCDi is being utilized - no doubt about that - I have checked it with the waving flag test in Video Essentials. No jaggies.

So you have the 318? Any answers to any other questions? Is component 1080i a reality? And what format/output(s) are you using for testing?

[NorthJersey]

has anyone seen this unit in stores in the NJ/NY metro area ? Sounds much better than the Toshiba sd5960

[psklenar]

Originally posted by Cinemaphile
DCDi is being utilized - no doubt about that - I have checked it with the waving flag test in Video Essentials. No jaggies.

Did you test that via DVI or Component? If DVI, would you please be so kind as to also test with Component? Pretty please? :)

Thanks!

[Cinemaphile]

I have the LG7832, but the Zenith player looks like it's a clone. I don't think the player is going to be any different than the LG. 1080i over component (with DCDi and excellent frequency response) is a reality.

[cinemagotham]

Well, there's no reason to believe yea or nay unless someone tests the 318 specifically. They could have changed something about it easily, especially at the firmware level. No reason to believe they're the same. But thanks for playing! We have some lovely parting gifts for you! ;)

[CaspianM]

Most likely they are the same units. I sent an email to Zenith about it and received a reply from LG. But that is not the reason, it is made by LG and I don't think they are going to change any thing to add cost.

[Q of BanditZ]

This will be most interesting then...

[cinemagotham]

Just looked over the LG thread again. I dunno, man. I'm starting to think that going with a quality non-upscaling player is the way to go. Too many problems, especially for those of us with "small" TVs like 32" (Q, I'm looking at you). I'm thinking maybe the time is coming to forget this machine and go with a Denon or something. I'm sick of using the PS2 as a player and don't want a machine with tons of problems. Oh well. I'll keep reading for updates!

[brightbulb]

No reason "re-authoring" the movie on your PC wouldn't solve this problem in most cases, especially since dual layer burners are coming out now.


LOL, so if I want to watch Godzilla, I start "re-authoring" on Tuesday night, reinstall the WinBlows Os on Wednesday night, redo all the drivers so they work properly on Thursday nigth, spend all night Friday night getting my M-audio Revolution to work (did I mention they are introducing new SPDIF drivers due out in 6 months!) so by Saturday night I'm good to go!
yep, been there done that! Welcome to better living through expensive HD products!

[CrazyINP]

Ok Guys,
I am still at work, but put a list with test that you want me to do,
I don't have AVIA or DVE but as someone said I will test it with THX disk that has setup menu and will check for "white crush"

For rest of you, I got mine from the closest dealer around me which I found online on Zenith dealer page not the online retailer.

Player said is build Dec.2003 and was boxed then, so is very possible to have the same firmware as Canadians.

Which of the latest movies are Copy-Protected so I can try it and see if I will be able to play them on 1080i or 720p.

I will do the test in couple hours as I said post list of the tests.

Anyone local (Bay Area) PM and I will send you the local dealer which I got it from, or you can simple go to Zenith web site and find it.

[whsbuss]

CrazyINP-

Just about any DVD that has the FBI warning is copy-protected. LOTR, Star Wars, etc.

Can't wait till you report back. If this really performs via component, I may ask you to pick up one and ship it.....

[CrazyINP]

Ok
I don't see deference btw componet and DVI seems like it really work the same, or it might just locks to 480p but for me it looks the same.

There is "white crush" thru DVI which is not there thru component

I tried THX disk which comes with Monster Inc.

My TV (GW III) doesn't report what signal is connected (480p-720p-1080i) it just locked the tv to full

[Sam S]

Originally posted by CrazyINP
My TV (GW III) doesn't report what signal is connected (480p-720p-1080i) it just locked the tv to full

I think there is a button on the Sony remote (Display?) that will put up the input resolution briefly on the screen.

Too bad about the white crush...

[brightbulb]

Do you know anyone you can borrow a projector from?
My X1 reports the resolution when it synchs up. It will say 1080i in a box down in the corner.

[CrazyINP]

There is DISPLAY button but won't report the res. which is really bad.:(


Originally posted by Sam Scamardo
I think there is a button on the Sony remote (Display?) that will put up the input resolution briefly on the screen.

Too bad about the white crush...

[CrazyINP]

I don't have anyone with projector that has component input.
I will check with co-worker tomorrow that has HDTV and see if his one report the res. and I will go and try it.


Originally posted by brightbulb
Do you know anyone you can borrow a projector from?
My X1 reports the resolution when it synchs up. It will say 1080i in a box down in the corner.

[aghusker]

Originally posted by CrazyINP
Ok


There is "white crush" thru DVI which is not there thru component



Another DVI player bites the dust!
I can't believe that I have waited this long, and the first two DVI player from major manufacturers (Toshiba, Zenith) have serious flaws!!
And I heard the Samsung HD-841/941 will have same issues w/ blacker than black as 931!

Slowly, but surely, my DVI-player list for 2004 is whittling down.
There is little hope for 2004.
Only Bravo D2/D3 and Panny S97 are left.
I'm betting on the D2 making the cut (if any).

[capecodguy]

Calm down all! I'm not sure it's time to give up on this one yet. So far, the only reports are from one person who admittedly is not a technological Wiz (and spells like my 6 year old...no offense guy!) Seriously, he's trying to give us his honest opinions but may not be totally qualified to judge all the results of the dozens of tests everyone is asking him to do. For instance, based on current postings, is anyone really ready to proclaim that this player suffers from white crush? Not me. Let's have a few more owners chime in before we judge.

[BillP]

Originally posted by aghusker
Another DVI player bites the dust!
I can't believe that I have waited this long, and the first two DVI player from major manufacturers (Toshiba, Zenith) have serious flaws!!
And I heard the Samsung HD-841/941 will have same issues w/ blacker than black as 931!

Slowly, but surely, my DVI-player list for 2004 is whittling down.
There is little hope for 2004.
Only Bravo D2/D3 and Panny S97 are left.
I'm betting on the D2 making the cut (if any).

There's also a Sony with HDMI (and SACD) coming out in Sept.

[brightbulb]

Originally posted by capecodguy
Calm down all! I'm not sure it's time to give up on this one yet. So far, the only reports are from one person who admittedly is not a technological Wiz (and spells like my 6 year old...no offense guy!) Seriously, he's trying to give us his honest opinions but may not be totally qualified to judge all the results of the dozens of tests everyone is asking him to do. For instance, based on current postings, is anyone really ready to proclaim that this player suffers from white crush? Not me. Let's have a few more owners chime in before we judge.

Correct, o' yoda type. No unit is going to be perfect. I'm not sure what "white crush" is. I would make trade offs for just 1080i out of component with copyrighted DVD's.

Yes, of course I want the best picture possible, but with an X1 on a Day-lite screen with ambient light coming in a window during the day, what can I expect?

[Q of BanditZ]

No risk here. When I take delivery of that unit in the next week or two, my Zenith dealer up the street will take care of me.

If I run into a slew of problems, it's out of here for a full refund without question. No worries.

[NorthJersey]

I think a good test for white crush would be the scene in Matrix Reloaded where Morpheus' ship is about to land in Zion. The control center(??) when they show the female operator talking to them, the scene is extremely bright white. Can someone test the player on this scene and see if there is a loss of detail ?

[BlazedTech]

I've have a few days left on my Sammy 931 test drive. I think I may return it and try this one.

[cinemagotham]

As soon as Best Buy gets it I'll nab it. They were good about taking back my JVC dvd player after I discovered it's crazy stutter problem and my Silver Sensor HD receiver as well. So that seems a safe bet. They're like a lending library as far as my experience goes!

[merc]

Has anyone else gotten this player besides Crazy?

Has anyone been able to test the upconversion via component on copy protected discs?

[zoro]

CRAZY dude!! U got PM, man!! Thnx

[JimSD]

To check whether 480p or 1080i is being output, some TVs will have different aspect ratio/stretch modes available for the different signals. For instance, 480p might have Full, 4:3, and Zoom whereas 1080i might only have Full. One thing to possibly check for to determine what is being output.

capecodguy, CrazyINP's findings on "white crush" are absolutely consistent with what has been widely reported with the LG-badged version of this unit. Since he did notice a difference in the test pattern between component and DVI, I think it's fair to say he got it right.

[Q of BanditZ]

So DVI useage is highly recommended then, I take it?