AVS Forum Archive 2 - Hitachi PJ-TX100

Ktak

05-23-04, 02:57 AM

I just got back from Akihabara to look at the Hitachi, and I am seriously considering selling my Z2! They just recently set up the TX100 in the ground floor demo room along side the Sanyo Z2, Pana AE500, Sony HS-20, Epson 200 and Sharp Z200 (Matterhorn DLP). Because I already own the Z2, I really didn't want to be impressed by the Hitachi, but I have to admit that it's improvements over the Z2 were not subtle to my eyes or my wife's.

The first thing that hits you is the DEEP black level compared to the Z2 or AE500. It was very close to the Sharp in this respect, which is amazing considering the Matterhorn chip that the Z200 uses. Also, color fidelity seemed more accurate, with none of the blue/green tinge that the Z2 displays. I've owned the Z2 for about 6 months and this tinge never really bothered me, but after seeing the Hitachi I'm afraid it will aways be at the back of my mind. Skin tones on the Hitachi were also excellent.

While I was there, they had an HDTV feed of today's Seattle Mariners game (the Mariners are still big here because of Ichiro, despite the crappy season they're having). When we lived in Seattle, we used to live just a few blocks from Safeco field, so we've been to a lot of Mariners games. The colors of the stadium, field and uniforms on the Hitachi were much more like I remember them than either the Panasonic or the Sanyo. The blue of the team caps especially were spot on (Trust me, I've got 3 or 4 of them for comparison).

But like I said, it's the blacks on this projector that set it apart from all the other LCDs in the room. During the broadcast, the score is displayed inside a black box. This made it easier to compare the quality of the black on each screen. I closed down the Z2's iris all the way and tweaked the brightness, but I couldn't match the Hitachi.

Image sharpness was also superior to any other LCD unit on display. This is most likely due to the quality (and quantity) of the lens assembly. This lens is HUGE! My wife and I actually laughed when we saw it because it stood out compared to the others. I hope I never have to find a filter for this baby! This lens may in fact be responsible for the TX100's only "weakness" that I could see. The pixels seem to be slightly more visible than any of the other projectors on display. I double checked the focus on the other projectors and they were all zeroed in, but the Hitachi's pixels just seemed a little bit more "there" for lack of a better word. It's almost like the inferior lenses on the other projectors provide a automatic "defocus" that masks the pixels even when the projector is supposedly in perfect focus. The Hitachi on the other hand shows the pixel gap nice and clear. I'm sure a little defocus on the Hitachi would remedy this to some degree, but seeing the pixels so clearly was a bit disconcerting and the only negative that I could find.

Vertical banding was equal to the Z2 which was almost non-existent on the sample I saw. Fan noise was also very low and exhausts from the front mounted vent. I would rate it equal to the Sanyo in this regard.

By the way Zippo, I'm not sure about the voltage, but the OSD I saw were in English.:D ). I think you'll be very impressed with this unit when you see it. I look forward to hearing your impressions.

Binnerup

05-23-04, 03:39 AM

About the price I can say that a danish dealer has set a price to 15.995 danish kr. for the Hitache PJ-TX100, while the Sanyo PLV-Z2 at the same dealer is priced also at 15.995 kr. (after they have changed the price a bit down), the PTAE-500 is 13.888 kr.

This should mean that the price is very equally the PLV-Z2, but a bit more expansive than the PTAE-500.

The dealer say they have it late may!

Durabolin

05-23-04, 04:16 AM

Ktak. Nice on the spot review. This somewhat confirms my suspicions that it might be the best of the 4 all things considered, including price. Yeah the lens assembly does look huge. Does the japan version use standard component inputs or that D4 contraption like the japanese Z2 ?

noah katz

05-23-04, 04:16 AM

Ktak,

Thanks for your impressions, the TX100 is sounding like a real contender.

Re the blacks, do you which iris and lamp settings it was using? Regardless, how was its brightness compared to the other pj's?

Also, I'd be interested to know how it compared to the Epson 200, which has been getting good press.

Thanks

Zippo

05-23-04, 05:48 AM

Ktak,

Sounds really good. If they have it up for demo, does this mean that they have it in stock in the shop or is it just a preview unit? If the price is good enough in Akihabara I might just take one home :). I haven't actually been to Akihabara yet since I live in Tachikawa and am working hard during weekdays. Do they have it in most stores or could you point out which store I should go to?

Thanks for a great teaser! Makes me very excited to see this one in real life.

danam

05-23-04, 07:26 AM

Ktak, thanks a lot for your review !

Good finally someone could see it on its latest update.
I'm very excited about getting mine, it should land in France very beginning of June maximum ...

I hope the screendoor is not too visible, but i guess it's a consequence of the amazing sharpness ...

Thanks again for your post here !

Ktak

05-23-04, 09:19 AM

Zippo, sorry about that. I just went over my last post and realized I didn't even mention which store I was at. It's the AVAC in Akihabara. I believe they have the Hitachi available for sale now, but I'll check tomorrow to be sure and post the confirmation on this thread. Their website says June availability, but it could just be for online orders.

Regarding the inputs, it uses regular component, not a D4. So buyers outside Japan should have no probems connecting their DVD players and HDTV set-top boxes. My HD cable box and Z2 both use D4 connections so I'll have to find a D4 to component adapter if I get the TX100. DVD feed would be DVI from a Momitsu V880.

Noah, I'm not sure about the lamp and iris settings, but the image brightness was roughly equivalent to the Z2 in low-lamp mode and iris closed down all the way (which is how I have mine set up). They were displayed on adjacent screens, so the comparison was easy to make. The Epson 200 was on right below the Z2 screen (For those unfamiliar with AVAC's set-up, they have projectors running on 6 screens in a 2 (high) by 3 (across) configuration. The Epson appeared to have a little better color balance than the Z2, but the Hitachi edged out both of them in every aspect of picture quality that I could see. The only question mark in my mind is the pixel visibility issue. I'll have to take a look at it a few more times to be sure it's something I can live with.

My wife's been talking about this projector all night. We're watching some HDTV right now and she keeps asking, "I wonder what this would look like on the Hitachi?" Anybody want to buy a second-hand Z2? A friend of mine just bought a Z2 because he liked the picture at our place so much. I hope he's not too pissed if I switch to the Hitachi soon.

wixy

05-23-04, 10:55 AM

I was thinking of upgrading from the tx10 to the tx100. Do you think it would be worth it? Screendoor does bother me at times but would it be signifcantly less with the tx100?

AVdawg

05-23-04, 11:10 AM

If this is the Hitachi answer to the z2 and panny 500 (like the Home-1 was to the z1 and 300, well... kind of) I can't wait the see it. Hopefully it'll be price competitive to the Sanyo and Panasonic. I'm very happy with my Home-1 but would strongly consider the upgrade.

The projector techs I've talked to seem to hold Hitachi in high regard. I'm going to keep my fingers crossed on this one.

Ursa

05-23-04, 11:28 AM

Let's see: MSRP is ¥262500, and street seems to be about the same as the Z2. Should be interesting.

http://av.hitachi.co.jp/homeproj/lineup/tx100j/index.html

Babelfish: http://babelfish.altavista.com/babelfish/trurl_pagecontent?lp=ja_en&url=http%3a%2f%2fav.hitachi.co.jp%2fhomeproj%2flineup%2ftx100j%2findex.html

Later,
Bill

0xdeadbeef

05-23-04, 01:31 PM

Two PDF brochures in case you don't know'em yet:

http://presentation-systems.co.uk/pdfs/hitachi-pj-tx100.pdf
http://csvav.com.au/hitachi_pj-tx100.pdf

What makes me a bit nervous is that neither of the PDFs mentions 576p (PAL progressive) which would be an important feature over here in Europe.

BTW: some dealers promised first units here in Germany for next week, then again, they promised already before ;) We shall see...

noah katz

05-23-04, 05:49 PM

Ktak,

"... the image brightness was roughly equivalent to the Z2 in low-lamp mode and iris closed down all the way (which is how I have mine set up)."

Do you know how many actual lumens that is?

Re the SD, can't you just defocusa a bit?

Thanks

Ursa

05-23-04, 06:51 PM

Noah - according to ProjectorCentral, that should be in the 400 - 500 lumen range.

Later,
Bill

noah katz

05-23-04, 07:37 PM

Thanks, Bill

driftway

05-23-04, 08:34 PM

One of the most attractive features of the Home-1 is the short throw. From the spec sheet it appears that the pj-tx100 is not as short, but close. It's too bad, since I want to project a near 100 inch diagonal from around 8 feet....

Ktak

05-23-04, 11:04 PM

Here's an update on availability in Japan. The projectors are being demoed in stores now, but they won't actually be available for sale until June 10. I was hoping this just applied to online sales at AVAC, but it also applies to store sales as well. Zippo, sorry to get your hopes up. If you're in the area, at least you'll be able to see it in action.

cpc

05-24-04, 09:54 AM

Would be nice to hear about availability in North America and also what the street price will be over here.

If anyone buys one, let us know how is goes, especially if you do more comparing with the other projectors.

Incidentally, the Japanese AE500 was going for peanuts from Japan but that must have been a typo. Its back to normal price :(

KCK7

05-24-04, 10:16 AM

cpc, pls define 'peanuts'... exactly how much? I would guess the movements in Japan are precursors to those in North America, and the Panny is on my screen (pun intended) as a potential purchase. A solid price drop might motivate me (and others) to wait.

danam

05-24-04, 12:03 PM

in France, they are delivered to our reseller by wednesday or thursday :)
Hitachi Europe got their projectors !!!!!!

Good Week-end incoming for me :)

(still need to go buy my DVI graphic card for my PCHT)

:D

cpc

05-24-04, 05:05 PM

Price has changed. Nevermind. Musta been a typo.

Durabolin

05-24-04, 05:58 PM

This Projector is now available in Australia. Priced slightly below the Z2 on the street. I am planning to see one in action next week.

EvanB

05-24-04, 06:55 PM

Any word on when it'll street in the U.S.?

Is the throw longer than a Panny 500u? I'm looking to use a Prismasonic H-500 lens and if this projector is better built with the ability to use such a lens then I may want one of these bad boys instead.

smyth22

05-25-04, 01:10 AM

This projector appears to have only a 1 year warranty. That seems to be out of step with most others.

cpc

05-25-04, 10:55 AM

I can almost garantee you can buy an extended warranty from Hitachi. They're known for their extended warrantees...but a one year warranty does seem kinda lame compared to Sanyo.

Furious

05-25-04, 03:04 PM

NA pricing will be in and around the AE500 pricing level. Unfortunately it will not be going for price point like Sanyo and the Z2.

manufanatic

05-25-04, 03:16 PM

Furious what are you basing that on. BTW the ae500 and the z2 sell for basically the same price here in the states. I was hoping that Hitachi would come in nearer the 1500 range that the 4805 is said to be MAP

Furious

05-25-04, 03:51 PM

Based on target SRP, which is not finalized, but expected to follow AE500 pricing in NA. As far as the Z2 comparison, the situation here in Canada is different. The AE500 is far higher than that of the Z2 here. The AE500 is sold via the consumer electronics side with full home video/theater margins where as the Z2 is sold via the industrial side as a presentation/IT piece with marginal margin. Typical tag pricing you can see is 4000-4299 for the AE500 and 2699-2999 on the Z2. Hitachi is positioning this as a home video piece with typical margins, and will be around the AE500 pricing. Canadians were probably hoping for a price alignment with the Z2 which isn't looking to be the case unfortunately.

Durabolin

05-25-04, 06:01 PM

Why are people hoping for unrealistic pricing points? In-line with the 4805? Insane ! If that on the spot review is accurate it is a superior product to both the Z2 and the AE500. I fail to see why it would be cheaper than the cheapest price one can find either of them for regardless of if its Canada or the US. It is certainly positioned as a dedicated home theatre prduct and i dont see any crossover uses mentioned in the PDF.

As i mentioned before in Australia it is priced just over the 500 and just under the Z2. Iwould say they have positioned it correctly.

Furious

05-25-04, 07:01 PM

As a dedicated home theater product, it would be considered in the AE500/HS20 bracket. As a lower tier vendor it would be expected that Hitachi would come in at a lower price point even though it could be argued to be a potentially superior product. One would have expected it to be priced lower in this market given the inflated SRP of the AE500 (as in Australia as well) and huge delta over the comparable Z2.

cpc

05-25-04, 07:12 PM

It will be interesting to see what the actual price for the Hitachi 100 is. Incidentally, I inquired at Epson about their warranty. According to a woman on the phone at Epson Canada service, in North America, Epson's from Canada and the US are warranteed the same in both countries. If that is the case with Hitachi, then just buy from the US if its too expensive up here.

What does the Hitachi PJ-TX10 go for in Canada at retail stores etc, roughly? No store names, just gimme a range that they sell for.

potus

05-25-04, 07:19 PM

It is actually natural to EXPECT products to get both better AND cheaper as time goes on in this relatively fast-moving technology.

The comparison with 4805 is a little like apples/oranges, though, as that is a DLP. ALL 720p DLPs are WAY more expensive than ANY 720p LCD, for example. (for whatever reason...)

noah katz

05-25-04, 07:42 PM

"it would be considered in the AE500/HS20 bracket. "

I believe it's generally accepted that the HS20 is in a bracket above the AE500/Z2, perhaps not so much on performance as on features

cpc

05-25-04, 07:44 PM

Any reviews out there? I hope somehow that Canadian pricing for the Hitachi PJ-TX100 is more in line with the Sanyo Z2 and not the Panasonic PT500.

Ktak

05-25-04, 08:05 PM

I find it very interesting that the AE500 and Z2 are in different pricing brackets in Canada. In Japan, the two have been head-to-head competitors almost from the day of release. Given their almost identical performance, it's amazing that Sanyo can sell any Z2s at all. People must really want the lens shift to justify the purchase. I have the Z2, but I would never have spent more than $100 over the AE500 just for the lens shift. I fully expect the Hitachi TX100 to drop down to the Z2/AE500 range here after it's been out for a few months. Right now it's priced about where the Z2/AE500 were upon introduction.

smyth22

05-25-04, 08:23 PM

CPC: I have seen it for about $2000 cdn.

cpc

05-25-04, 09:29 PM

Right. It goes for $1299 USD down south. Here's hoping the PJ-TX100 is priced like the Z2 in Canada.

The Projector Central review of the Hitachi Home 10 did mention that pixel structure was somewhat more noticable than other projectors. Although I'm not sure that was pixels or screen door. May correlate with the pixel look of the PJ-TX100.

Furious

05-25-04, 10:15 PM

The PJX10 is a sub 2K CDN price point piece, priced in the same range as an AE200 (which was a bit lower as Panasonic was trying to move some inventory at reduced cost to dealers). The HS20 is priced higher simply because it's Sony, and they charge a privelege for their name over features/performance. Even if the projectors were spec for spec, feature for feature the same, Sony would add 10-20 points just for the sake of it. It's a weird one upping the Jones' type of thing.

It is strange to see the price point strategies here in Canada, and it's largely due to projectors falling unconformably into a segement somewhere between an industrial division catering to the IT/presentation market and a CE division catering to CE retailers. When we get lucky the manufacturers turn it over to their industrial divisions and the margin suddenly becomes reasonable and street prices more affordable.

If on the other hand it hits the CE side of things you can bet that at least 25-40 points will be added to dealer cost to come up with the target SRP resulting in the ugly street prices which are out of line with US pricing. If we had a more developed IT/presentation market for projectors as in the US or a wider dealer network you might see more reasonable price points. As it stands the projectors are low volume sales via select chain retailers and independents who often will not support the products without the higher margin range as above. A good example of this is the Infocus X1 piece, which was treated largely as an IT piece with distribution through IT related distributors such as Ingram Micro vs the Toshiba clone of the X1 which was treated as a home theater piece, with dealer cost differing as much as $500-600 CDN at times between the two pieces. I'd like the lower price point but I understanding why they are pursuing the route they are...

Ozviewer

05-25-04, 11:25 PM

According to Hitachi Australia yesterday, the PJ-TX100 is due into their warehouse in mid-June with retail availability late June or early July. I note that Durobolin says the PJ is available now, but I do not know where.

Ozviewer

Newleaf

05-26-04, 01:54 AM

Just a little insight on pricing in canada.( I hope ). The pj-tx10( small brother? ) ... I have seen listed for about $1300-1400 usd ..online. Up here a big electronics chain sells it for $2000cad. Thats about on par I figure when converting. I'm crossing my fingers that this retailer will price the pj-tx100 the same way, guessing the $2700-3000cad range if it specs out like a z2.

off topic: anybody in calagry area want to demo their 6100/6200?

GO! FLAMES! GO!

Jay

potus

05-26-04, 09:34 AM

In England, the TX-10 can be found for 729GBP. (not including VAT). At current exchange rates, this is equal to $1325, which coincidentally, seems to be about what these sell for here.

The TX-100 is at 895GBP. This is equal to $1627 !!!

We can only hope for the best, but these figures are encouraging...

Vic Y

05-26-04, 09:58 AM

I am new to the projector world. I probably going to pick between TX-100 and 4805. At this price point $1500 - $1700, these 2 projectors is very reasonable price and very promising. I will watch 95% HD or DVD on the projector.

0xdeadbeef

05-26-04, 10:42 AM

TX-100 is out in Germany since today. First dealers got their devices and are able to deliver.

danam

05-26-04, 11:46 AM

first preview in france says it looks pretty good at first sight.

no screendoor
good contrast (but still need to play with the iris)

this is a "out of the box" feeling, the reseller is still working on the pj but should say more about the "beast".

a german review says DVI 1280 x 720 works fine at 50 Hz, same for DVI 576p ...
very quiet.
very wide zoom
nice black levels settings (close to DLP technology)
tons of settings possible with integrated tests pics for gamma settings (for example)

looks pretty good :)

danam

05-26-04, 11:47 AM

here is the link of the german review :

http://212.105.197.43/vbportal/forums/showthread.php?threadid=50344

(provided by Grubert on www.homecinema-fr.Com/forum )

KCK7

05-26-04, 02:26 PM

This should make good reading if...

Is it possible to Babelfish an entire thread?

potus

05-26-04, 02:36 PM

I couldn't get babelfish to work, but the "translate tool" on google.com (http://www.google.com/language_tools) seemed to work. Just paste in the URL...

gwlaw99

05-26-04, 02:49 PM

Only £895.00 in Britain.. Wow! This is $1,633

http://www.ivojo.co.uk/hitachi-pj-tx100.htm

KCK7

05-26-04, 02:49 PM

Googled this for the first time... pretty amazed at how many resellers there are for Hitachi PJs in Eu and Jp. I have not had much luck locating etailers or even B&M stores in the US for this brand. Very few show up...

cpc

05-26-04, 03:19 PM

The PJ-TX10 is sold in Canada for as low as $1875.00 CDN. I will hopefully see the PJ-TX100 priced reasonabley too. There are many places in Canada that carry Hitachi stuff.

I await reviews and further info about the Hitachi 100. Its looking very promising. I am sticking with my L200 for now, as my money situation is rather lame. Just gotta blow out some dust blobs and the L200 is going to be fine. Not a big improvement over my AE100, but anyways.... My choices for upgrade are now the Hitachi PJ-TX100 or Sanyo Z2, or failing those, the Panny PT500.

Maltby

05-26-04, 03:45 PM

This looks interesting to me too. But the picture in the brochure seems to exaggerate the amount of optical horizontal shift it can do. In the picture, there is a sofa with the projector on a table next it. But at the 1/4 screen size shift figure they give, an 8 ft screen only gives 2 ft of shift. That doesn't put it next to the sofa, that puts it on the sofa towards the end.

cpc

05-26-04, 05:40 PM

Lens shift is handy I'm sure, but for me, I won't be using any in my current setup. In any setup I use, I would tend to aim for zero lens shift. No matter what you do, isn't there some distortion of the image that results from lens shift? You know, like un-even barrel or pincusion distortion or chromatic problems or some other issues. You can't shift the picture like that and have a perfect image, can you?

Anybody aware of the expected arrival time for the Hitachi PJ TX100 in North America?

If people come across reviews, please post links :)

gwlaw99

05-26-04, 06:32 PM

"Anybody aware of the expected arrival time for the Hitachi PJ TX100 in North America?"

It will probably have a different name. The PJ TX10 is called the "Home 1" in North America.

Furious

05-26-04, 06:43 PM

It's sold in Canada as the PJTX10 (caused confusion as I was trying to get cost on a Home 1 and was getting blank stares) at 1999 SRP.

smyth22

05-26-04, 08:59 PM

Saw it at just over $1700 on close out; not terribly impressed; SDE and black level/detail issues; hope the 100 is a whole lot better and it sounds like it might be. Haven't heard anyone who has seen the 100 compare it to the 10; that would be interesting.

Peter

cpc

05-26-04, 09:28 PM

Yeah, Canada calls its Hitachi's by model humber alone, no "Home".

Alex

05-26-04, 09:37 PM

I cannot believe that every single PDF for this projector omits 576p by accident. Especially those PDFs for PAL countries!
There's something going on here.
Usually, if a company cannot garantee full compliance then they will not specify compatibility even though it may work 99% of the time.

KCK7

05-26-04, 11:14 PM

The German thread posted above discussed 576p and one of the posters confirmed and reassured the others that it DOES have 576p. I ran the Google translator, but even so it was a bit tricky to follow.

yipchunyu

05-27-04, 02:56 AM

Hi guys, I need the horizontal len shift function but how far can it display? any idea?

noah katz

05-27-04, 03:00 AM

"isn't there some distortion of the image that results from lens shift? "

FYI, the common vertical offset hat places the lens even with the top or bottom of the screen is using lens shift to do so.

yipchunyu

05-27-04, 03:44 AM

just check the pdf file in the hitachi's web site and found the info.
The horizontal len shift provides a much narrow range than the z2. The total screen size with len shift is 1.5 screen . It means it can shift about 1/4 screen from left or right. I think it's not very useful then.
Besides, anyone use the old models from Hitachi's lcd projectors? The Home 1? Just want to know the average bulb life. I'm looking forward to this pj and so far from I learned. It provides a better pq than the z2 and ae500 and it's not a DLP. (i'm sensitive to rainbows)

Grubert

05-27-04, 04:08 AM

PAL progressive support confirmed by a Montpellier retailer.

I translate what he said on the French forum:

Test done on component progressive from a HK DVD22 player.

Picture is very detailed, and the contrast is amazing for an LCD. A customer saw the PJ running and remarked, "It looks like a DLP".

Black level is very good, though not quite as good as the Yamaha LPX510.

As regards value-for-money, it creams the Sanyo PLV-Z2 and the Optoma H30.

There's lots of setup options, so with some tweaking time it can only get better.

Afterwards, tested on interlaced (also with the DVD22). The projector deinterlaces very well.

smyth22

05-27-04, 04:51 AM

Hi Grubert: Not familar with the Yamaha 510; how would its black levels compare to a good dlp. Any discussion of screen door on the French site or how the 100 would compare to say the lower priced higher resolution dlps like the Benq 6200.

Thanks
Peter

Dan Hitchman

05-27-04, 01:49 PM

Still no word on when it will be released in the States? (Yes, I am impatient)

How is the throw ratio in comparison to the Z2? I want to be able to use an anamorphic lens (like the ISCO II or Prismasonic H-500) for a 2.35:1 constant height screen, but I don't want a bunch of chromatic aberations and barrel/pin-cushion distortions.

Dan

potus

05-27-04, 02:20 PM

throw ratio range is 1.38-2.2... (distance /screen width)

cpc

05-27-04, 02:27 PM

I think the LPX-510 is the Yamaha boutique-ish rebadge of the Epson TW100 (H?).

Aneldefogo

05-27-04, 02:28 PM

i had see today the hitachi tx 100, and the optoma h30, with my wife and she prefer the optoma image; the price in Portugal is about 2150 euros; it´s expensive for the quality. Optoma give better image then hitachi.
sorry my english
regards from Portugal

Furious

05-27-04, 03:02 PM

Expected arrival time is July/August here. Expect to pay 4K.

Originally posted by cpc
Lens shift is handy I'm sure, but for me, I won't be using any in my current setup. In any setup I use, I would tend to aim for zero lens shift. No matter what you do, isn't there some distortion of the image that results from lens shift? You know, like un-even barrel or pincusion distortion or chromatic problems or some other issues. You can't shift the picture like that and have a perfect image, can you?

Anybody aware of the expected arrival time for the Hitachi PJ TX100 in North America?

If people come across reviews, please post links :)

Dan Hitchman

05-27-04, 03:11 PM

Did I read you right Furious? $4,000?? Are they kidding?? It would have to beat out an HD2+ DLP to be paying that amount for an LCD what with the cheaper BenQ models.

Maybe it'll be better to just forget the 2.35:1 screen idea and go with a BenQ 8700+ even though it won't work with an anamorphic lens.

Dan

noah katz

05-27-04, 03:25 PM

"I think the LPX-510 is the Yamaha boutique-ish rebadge of the Epson TW100 (H?)."

Not sure about name differences gor various countries, but the LPX-510 is based on the Epson Cinema 500

nosdmi

05-27-04, 03:43 PM

Originally posted by Dan Hitchman
Did I read you right Furious? $4,000?? Are they kidding?? It would have to beat out an HD2+ DLP to be paying that amount for an LCD what with the cheaper BenQ models.

Maybe it'll be better to just forget the 2.35:1 screen idea and go with a BenQ 8700+ even though it won't work with an anamorphic lens.

Dan

I have no idea what Furious is basing his number on, but it is entirely inconsistent with the pricing in Europe and makes no sense given the specs on the projector. Read earlier in this thread for details about pricing in the UK or just type the projector name into google.

Furious, if you have actual information, please share the source. Otherwise, your post just seems unnecessary.

Furious

05-27-04, 03:53 PM

That'll be Canadian retail Dan (arrival times as well).

Originally posted by Dan Hitchman
Did I read you right Furious? $4,000?? Are they kidding?? It would have to beat out an HD2+ DLP to be paying that amount for an LCD what with the cheaper BenQ models.

Maybe it'll be better to just forget the 2.35:1 screen idea and go with a BenQ 8700+ even though it won't work with an anamorphic lens.

Dan

Digital2004

05-27-04, 03:55 PM

is there vertical banding on the TX100 like on the Z2?

isn't retail in Europe Euro 1699 ?

Digital2004

05-27-04, 03:58 PM

I can see a lot of TX10 owners angry.

Furious

05-27-04, 04:04 PM

Direct from source. Obviously I can't go into explicit detail but target SRPs and arrival times are fine to discuss. Yes the pricing is inconsistent, which I've gone over in this thread. Canada is an odd market, none of our pricing tends to be consistent in categories like this, same deal with plasmas. I can order a Panny 42" at retail from the US and still pay less than dealer cost minus staff purchase plan price direct from Panasonic. What does that tell you? Again I'm not trying to dampen enthusiasm, but the Canadian pricing is not going to be an attractive budget price point as per other markets as many here are hoping. I trust this post meets with your approval?

Originally posted by nosdmi
I have no idea what Furious is basing his number on, but it is entirely inconsistent with the pricing in Europe and makes no sense given the specs on the projector. Read earlier in this thread for details about pricing in the UK or just type the projector name into google.

Furious, if you have actual information, please share the source. Otherwise, your post just seems unnecessary.

potus

05-27-04, 04:18 PM

I thought the tx10 was around $2000 in Canada. The TX100 should only be 24% higher (based on relative prices in europe...) That would bring it to $2480.... Significantly less than $4000... So.... what's up with that? Perhaps they don't actually want to sell any of these in Canada?

cpc

05-27-04, 05:16 PM

Yeah, that wouldn't make a whole lot of sense because it'll be even more obvious that the price is out of line when you compare their own models in the US and Canada, and one model is equitabley priced while the other is not. That is, if $4K CDN is in fact the expected price. Did you say SRP? Perhaps retail will be less. Then again, nothing ever makes sense in Canada. I asked a dealer to get back to me asap on a price for the TX100, and that'll be the deciding factor for me. The Hitachi has a one year warranty and an extra year is $490 CDN! Unless the PJ-TX 100 is the same price as the Z2, as in $2699 CDN or within a few hundred dollars, AND it is worth it due to better black levels, contrast or whatever, then I won't bother.

What'll be important for many, regardless of where you're from, is a direct comparison of the Hitachi PJ-TX100 with the Sanyo Z2/SE 2HD and Panasonic PT500. Bring on the reviews.

Furious

05-27-04, 05:54 PM

Yes SRP, which will end up between 3500-4000, hence you'd being paying around 4K with taxes in assuming PST+GST. There's not a ton of wiggle room to come down on street prices, but you may see a couple of hundred off that eventually. Even at dealer cost I wouldn't consider it a great buy, due to the pricing in non-Canadian markets. A lesser SRP would mean more volume but on other hand it would make it less attractive to dealers carrying other lines like the HS20's and AE500's of the world.

Jonty12

05-27-04, 06:03 PM

Hitachi Canada told me it would be available in late June in Canada. See the previous thread on this projector.

I can't dispute Furious' SRP # as they couldn't tell me. They were happy to tell me release date though (after researching it).

Durabolin

05-27-04, 06:47 PM

In OZ i can find it for around $3,100 aussie dollars which is around $2,200 US dollars. I might add the Australian market is not particularly competitive so i would expect the US street price to be well under $2,000 USD.

At the moment it seems to me the UK has the best pricing on this model. Around $1,750 USD.

As for Canada... heeheh you guys seems to have more inconsistent pricing than us here in Australia. At least you guys have easy importing options from south of the border. Try doing that from Sydney .

nosdmi

05-27-04, 06:51 PM

Originally posted by Furious
Direct from source. Obviously I can't go into explicit detail but target SRPs and arrival times are fine to discuss. Yes the pricing is inconsistent, which I've gone over in this thread. Canada is an odd market, none of our pricing tends to be consistent in categories like this, same deal with plasmas. I can order a Panny 42" at retail from the US and still pay less than dealer cost minus staff purchase plan price direct from Panasonic. What does that tell you? Again I'm not trying to dampen enthusiasm, but the Canadian pricing is not going to be an attractive budget price point as per other markets as many here are hoping. I trust this post meets with your approval?

Knowing that you mean Canadian dollars makes a world of difference. Canada has seemed to be a very strange market in terms of pricing. I hope the US market pricing will more closely mirror the UK.

potus

05-27-04, 07:02 PM

So, who's got some good friends in England?

cpc

05-27-04, 07:56 PM

...yeah...lol..Forget Japan..Its UK time :D

Furious

05-27-04, 08:44 PM

I'm English, but living in Canada...doh! ;)

cpc

05-27-04, 08:48 PM

My father was born in Manchester. I've yet to apply for my British Passport....on a serious note, I guess ordering from the UK isn't out of the question, however, its not easy, is it?

potus

05-27-04, 10:12 PM

Well, I was thinking more along the lines of friends/acquaintances who may cross the pond on a regular basis. Perhaps they could be convinced to tuck a tx100 in their bag on the way over here.

doggiedog

05-27-04, 10:32 PM

Stolen from the RPTV forum (http://www.twice.com/article/CA421535.html?display=Breaking+News)

So it looks like it will come out sometime within the next 30 days or so.

cpc

05-28-04, 12:17 AM

...right..well I wasn't about to fly there to pick one up!

Again, best retail price in Canada and reviews, feedback from owners will dictate what its worth to me.

Digital2004

05-28-04, 01:23 AM

so far the buzz is that it's much better than the infamous Z2 with its "impossible to correctly calibrate colors" and its permanent vertical banding and poor luminosity in whisper mode.
the Hitachi on paper looks very promising, with lens shift (vert and hor), sleek looks and great menus. contrast is said to be even better than the Sharp Z9000.
question remains on vertical banding ( a test for all lcds !) and reliability.

danam

05-28-04, 02:35 AM

I'm coming to california by the end of June :P close to Fontana, Rancho Cucamunga ;)

Ktak

05-28-04, 03:14 AM

I'll vouch for the "better colors out of the box" description for the TX100. The sample I saw at AVAC looked great compared to the Z2 right next to it. I'm sure the deeper blacks that I saw added to the perceived richness of the image, but it was also simple things like the color of a baseball cap or or the color of the dirt at Safeco Field during a HDTV broadcast that just seemed right. The slightly more visible screendoor has me a little concerned, but if this can be corrected with a little defocus, I'm sold. If I have time, I may try to go back again this weekend to take another look.

Grubert

05-28-04, 04:15 AM

A French forum member has posted the following review. Note he has demoed at home the following projectors during the last 2 and a half years: Sony CS1, Sanyo Z1 and Z2, and Panasonic AE300 and 500 on LCD; and Infocus X1, Sharp Z90 and Z200, Optoma H30 and NEC HT1000 for DLP.

I've been playing with the TX100 for more than 3 hours now, and I have to admit I think it's very nice (the adjective 'nice' is not derogatory, but it shows my slight reservations towards it ;) )

It looks very good, with its huge lens, and you can place it really anywhere (at my house, with a 4 metre distance, you get a 2.4m wide image no problem).
It's quiet, whether on Eco or Standard mode.
The menus are correct, the remote is responsive (it's somewhat small, but no matter, I'm going to transfer the codes on to my Pronto...).

About the PQ...

The TX100 ranks at the top of the LCD bunch but it's still below an NEC HT1000, for instance. The picture out of the box is good but it can be improved with the numerous setup options. The screendoor is very slight, provided viewing distance is twice the picture width. Contrast is good, detail in dark areas is good while keeping an excellent brightness (the iris is nice to have, but better not to close it fully). Colours are saturated and quite realistic (though there is still room for improvement).
Deinterlacing is also very good: I noticed hardly any differences with my HK25, a bit sharper in progressive mode. I always leave the deinterlacing to the player, which I find more effective.
A very nice feature is the possibility of adjusting the overscan.

In comparison with the Sanyo Z2 and the Panasonic AE500, the Hitachi defends itself very well. I find it superior in almost all areas and the setup possibilities leave hope for future tweaking.

But (yes, there's a but) it has the most annoying flaw of LCDs: vertical banding. It's rather visible on my unit, at least as much as on the Sanyo Z2 if not more.

Maybe by driving the projector at its panel resolution via DVI this artifact will diminish, as it has been observed on the Yamaha LPX510 with a Pioneer 868.

So the verdict is positive, but with this reservation (important to me but maybe not to everybody).

Anyway, for €1500, this projector is a steal. It's not worth it to spend more on gear that will be outdated in a year (the joys of video projection!), but I feel tweaking has only begun.

hugo2002

05-28-04, 07:17 AM

... www.heimkinoraum.de ....

ssj2

05-28-04, 09:15 AM

Ktak, can you give us an idea of the size of the image you saw, and how far from the screen you were? I'm trying to get a feel for the screendoor issue. Thanks.

Grubert

05-28-04, 10:44 AM

"For a moment we thought we'd turned on our Yamaha DPX1000". That's a good one!!

Ktak

05-28-04, 07:26 PM

All the projectors at AVAC's "entry level" room are shown on 80-inch screens. I would guess that I was standing less than 2 screen widths away, so it's not ususual that I would see screendoor. My concern is that it seemed a bit more visible at the time than the Z2's picture which was the same distance away.

noah katz

05-28-04, 07:48 PM

Hmm...has anyone else noticed VB on the TX100?

danam

05-29-04, 07:06 PM

people saw VB on TX100 in France. but it seems to vary depending on how you feed it.
Mine is connected to a HTPC and I don't see VB.

noah katz

05-29-04, 08:20 PM

I don't see how the source could cause it; maybe it's just unit-to-unit variation.

Thanks

potus

05-29-04, 09:02 PM

Apparently the Epson Cinema 500 has user adjustments that can reduce or eliminate vertical banding.

Perhaps the Hitachi can be tweaked, too?

- Frank

noah katz

05-29-04, 09:36 PM

"Apparently the Epson Cinema 500 has user adjustments that can reduce or eliminate vertical banding."

The 200 does as well

cpc

05-30-04, 11:31 AM

Keep the feedback coming. With the Hitachi, can you slightly defocus to get rid of the screendoor? Isn't the Hitachi 100 the same for screendoor viewing distance? 1.4/1.5x screen width should be fine, correct? TW100, Z2 and PT500 are all ok at this distance.

remaisisqo

05-30-04, 01:44 PM

Does anyone know how to access to factury menu on the PJTX100 or 10 maybe?
Thanks in advance

Lou_1

05-30-04, 02:29 PM

Here is something: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?postid=3547077

{from other forum thread}

Lou_1

05-30-04, 02:40 PM

Not Hitachi's page but a good summary of the specifications: http://www.ivojo.co.uk/hitachi-pj-tx100.htm

{previously posted in this thread}

Grubert

06-01-04, 08:55 AM

Direct comparison between TX100 and Sanyo Z2 (in German, use babelfish):

http://212.105.197.43/vbportal/forums/showthread.php?threadid=50548

On Friday I looked at a Hitachi Illumina PJ TX100 out of interest times and rehearse-see myself after one hour equal pack up-letting and with home taken.
Here my first pressing into the comparison to the PLV Z2:
Clearly more brightly
higher-contrast
better, stronger colors
sharper Optik(der hammer)
better menu
larger zoom shot range
smaller Lensshift

Unfortunately the equipment is claimant also somewhat louder than my Z2(habe I in the Ecomodus always). The noise level is however still very small.

I operate the Beamer momentarily at the HTPCper DVI(1280x720, 60hz) and at a Tevion DVD recorder to the Fernsehen(576P).

Over the DVI entrance the part accumulates to genuine high form, has me immediately beeindruckt(hat even my friend immediately seen!!!!)

Also over Yuv 576P it goes clearly better than my Z2

I tested, find s-video also better briefly I.

The projector is simple my opinion after in the 2000 euro-price class the hammer!!!!
I spent myself and obtain not yet times 30 minutes with to adjust in each regard better results as with my Sanyo Z2, and super already really goes. (I did not read yet times the guidance!)
The only small who courage drop is the slightly higher operating noise, which really does not disturb me however.

Thus my first Resumee: OVER FLIER, and for schlappe 1600 Kracher!!

Durabolin

06-01-04, 09:39 AM

Well i guess the gist of that garbled translation is it kicks the Z2s ass. Thank god for internet translators :)

madpoet

06-01-04, 09:59 AM

No offense, but some garbled translation from a reviewer that I have no idea about isn't exactly going to sway me ;)

Durabolin

06-01-04, 10:03 AM

I didnt realize you were looking to be swayed :)

Incidentally what projector are you currently running ?

madpoet

06-01-04, 10:06 AM

Merely a comment on the people who seem to be holding their breath that this is going to set a new market trend. There have been a couple of posts today about how this machine is going to crush the Z2/500.

I'm currently running an AE500 (Japanese model). If I had it to do over, I'd have a Z2 or an HS20.

cpc

06-01-04, 10:20 AM

madpoet,

Really. A Z2? Why? I thought you liked your 500. The only drawback of the 500 is the peak-a-boo scanlines and the possibility that the contrast isn't as good as the Z2, but the Z2 has its problems too. So why would you go with the Z2?

Anyways...I'm waiting to hear what the final street price for the Hitachi will be in Canada. If its not in line, I'll contact Hitachi and point out their PJ-TX10 price in Canada and the US. I hope the Hitachi is priced reasonably, performs really well and has a decent bulb life and reliability. Hitachi is generally a good company.

dusk

06-01-04, 10:25 AM

I assume that the anamorphic lens add-ons won't work too well with this projector either for it's large lens or for it's relative short throw at minimum zoom.

madpoet

06-01-04, 10:25 AM

As I've said... I like my 500 a lot. I actually SLIGHTLY prefer the 500 picture. But the Z2 has so many user friendly features that I really wish I could get one ;). Lens shift would make me a very happy man. The longer throw would have saved me a few hundred bucks for a long throw lens when I bought my panamorph. I tossed in the HS20 because the ability to run a 768 desktop would be nice also.

I agree, Hitachi is a good company. I own a fairly top of the line RPTV from them (57XWX20B) and they always given me fairly good support once I got past the mindless telephone answering drones (I actually had one yelling at me that broadcast flags were in place on OTA content). I hope this projector is a great one, at a great price, and that it provides us with something new to talk about. I'm just not drinking the coolaid yet like a couple of posters seem to have done ;)

Grubert

06-01-04, 10:30 AM

Originally posted by madpoet
No offense, but some garbled translation from a reviewer that I have no idea about isn't exactly going to sway me ;)

On homecinema-fr.com there are a lot of happy new users. Then again, they are French, so you shouldn't listen to them. ;)

madpoet

06-01-04, 10:32 AM

Don't get me started on the French ;)

cpc

06-01-04, 11:39 AM

...lol...watching Jerry Lewis DVD's...heheh..

Yeah thats cool. Well, being that the Z2 and 500 are so similar, I could go with the Z2 simply because of the 3 year legit Canadian warranty that makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside, or go for the 500 because of the bulb life. I will probably view one in action. I want to see the "peak-a-boo" scanlines for myself, as I've seen them on my AE100. All it takes is to reduce the screen size a tad and de-focus and I see no sde or peak-a-boo.

I'm waiting on the price of the Hitachi PJ-TX100 before I break out any koolaid. I still have to sell my stuff before I buy a new PJ.

cpc

06-01-04, 04:49 PM

Just got a note from a Canadian retailer that Canadian MSRP will in fact be $3999 CDN as Furious pointed out. Not looking good. Thanx Hitachi. I guess its back to a Sanyo Z2 or PT500 again.

Jonty12

06-01-04, 05:15 PM

i'm glad i got my hs20 when i did instead of waiting for the tx100. similar price to that msrp.

potus

06-01-04, 05:34 PM

So in Canada, the TX-100 is 100% more than the TX-10, and everywhere else in the world it is only 24% more??

weird

0xdeadbeef

06-01-04, 06:13 PM

Germany:
Cheapest online price for TX10 is 1111€, cheapest online price for TX100 is the retail price of 1999€ (+80%). Both including VAT of 16%. Some local dealers are said to sell the TX100 for 1799€, but this is still about 62% more than the TX10.

Lou_1

06-01-04, 06:28 PM

I've had my Home-1 (TX-10) for a few months - about 110 hours of use. Had the TX-100 been available in the U.S. when I bought my Home-1, I probably would have paid 62% more. I think the difference is worth the money (even though my use is DVD exclusive).

That said, I am extremely happy with my Home-1 - especially as a first PJ. I will not upgrade as soon as the TX-100 comes out in the U.S. but I may compare it to what is available in that range in the later part of 2005.

Just my $0.02
~ Lou ~

cpc

06-01-04, 07:24 PM

Lou,

What is your screen size and viewing distance?

:)

potus

06-01-04, 07:24 PM

0xdeadbeef

Ok, so maybe the UK prices are weird? (guess I shouldn't have said "everywhere else in the world...") At four separate online UK dealers, the prices where VERY similar and ALL had TX-100 only 23-24% higher than TX-10. I won't quote the exact prices. Use Google if you are curious.

The UK TX100 price is about 8% less than your "best" price in Germany, so I guess that's not too far off..

Still holding my breath on the US price!! (At least there's no VAT here!)

tsteves

06-01-04, 07:38 PM

I was getting excited before this whole price descepancy thingy started.
SERENITY NOW!

Lou_1

06-01-04, 08:20 PM

CPC,
Screen is 92" wide. I use full width for 2.35:1 and a bit less for 1.85:1. Seating distance is 15'. However, this is in my living room with an "L" curve sofa. So 15' is the farthest. When more than three people, I sit on the closer seats - sometimes as close as 8-10' and at almost 45 degree angle. Picture is still awesome.

The chip has the "MLH" (correct designation?) feature so with a tiny touch of defocus, pixels bloom and SDE disappears. Even at perfect focus, SDE is only noticeable in the brightest scenes. I only noticed it for the first two or three movies because I was looking for it. After I stopped looking for it, I stopped seeing it altogether.

If I can provide any other info - happy to help.
~ Lou ~

rlindo

06-01-04, 11:42 PM

Hmm, I hadnt heard of this PJ until 15 minutes ago. It sounds interesting and maybe an upgrade from my z2. Yes, I said I was done with LCD in that thread I started but MAYBE just MAYBE Hitachi has found a way to severely decrease the chance of colour uniformity issues and polarizer issues.

I will wait for people to get it and hopefully they can log on hundreds of hours over the next 3-4 months. :) Then, if things look good maybe I'll get.

noah katz

06-02-04, 12:23 AM

"Canadian MSRP will in fact be $3999 CDN as Furious pointed out. Not looking good. Thanx Hitachi. I guess its back to a Sanyo Z2 or PT500 again."

Is Canada not like the U.S., where MSRP may bear little resemblance to street price?

cpc

06-02-04, 12:45 AM

It is possible that MSRP may bear little resemblance to street price. Lets review:

The MSRP for the Panasonic AE500 in Canada is $4999 CDN.
The AE500 can be found for sale on the "street" for between $3499 and $4499. That means that the AE500 can be found for as low as 0.69 x the MSRP.

So if the MSRP for the Hitachi is $3999 then x 0.69 = $2749 which is right on the money. So in my view, actually, an MSRP of $3999 is not yet indicative of Panasonic Canada like street pricing. What is the MSRP for the Hitachi TX-10 and does anyone remember the MSRP for the Sanyo Z2? I can't find that. The Sanyo.ca website crashes. I would guess it was $3499 to $3999 CDN. ?

There is still hope for a Hitachi PJ-TX100 priced pretty much like the Sanyo Z2. Especially since Hitachi's PJ-TX10 is priced identically in the US and Canada when you convert currency. I'd think it would be really weird if they don't follow that relationship with the 100.

Don't give up hope people! Canadians may soon have another 1280 x 720p LCD projector to choose :)

Jonty12

06-02-04, 12:45 AM

noah,

it depends on the manufacturer. dealers in canada don't get the prices they do in the US. as an example, the panasonic ae500 goes for about the same price as a sony hs20. the hs20 goes for about 10% under msrp usually ($5K CDN MSRP). the z2, on the other hand, is much closer to US pricing in terms of what the manufacurer will allow.

not sure how it will work with the hitachi, but it maybe msrp.

cpc

06-02-04, 12:53 AM

Ah-ha. Its still early in Alberta! Like 10 pm? Time for me to go to sleep now. Its 1:00 am.

Whenever anyone hears of the Canadian street price for the Hitachi 100, please let us know its out there.

Furious

06-02-04, 01:39 AM

There's not enough margin to be able to do a 2700 CDN street price based on a 3999 SRP. SRP will be indicative of street price in this case given the lowerish margin. If they go towards the higher side of the range at 3999 you'll see maybe a few hundred off of that. The $5000 SRP and actual dealer cost the 500 is a very large gap. The 3499-3999 SRP on the Hitachi and actual dealer cost is a much smaller gap.

Not to flog a dead horse but it's not going to be priced where you want it to be. Put it like this, I was looking at buying direct through Hitachi's dealer staff purchase plan which involves a further reduction off of dealer cost. Even that doesn't put the price where you'd like it to be (nor where I'd like it to be). You may see a drop in cost around November, when Panasonic tentatively has an AE500 replacement scheduled for release in Canada, depending of course on where Panasonic prices it. Unfortunately there won't be a ton of peer pressure from the other major manufacturers on Hitachi as there isn't much in the way of agressively priced 720P LCD units due out this year. A well known tier one manufacturer plans on launching a 480p (!) unit at a 2000 CDN SRP...what does that tell you about our woeful market at this point! Pack your bags, we're going on a border excursion!

Newleaf

06-02-04, 02:28 AM

Personally I think panasonic is taking us canadians for a ride when it comes to their ae500. We can get the z2 here now at a good price now. Its a 10 minute walk to a local electronic chain for me to pick up a tx-10 and at a price comparable to us dealers. I think CPC has the right thinking about the end price of the tx-100. I think the z2 mrsp was high also like $2500-3000us ( $4000+ here ) and the street price is a good margin below that.

Hopefully the dealer near me will get tx-100. I don't see why not. The big question will be when?

Pricing and availibility aside, I did notice a couple of things from the data at the link above. the tx-100 seems to share a short throw and wide zoom range as the tx-10 has. Another trait I wish the tx-100 has from its smaller brother is the cheaper bulbs.

I have quick question about sde. Do you guys think having a shorter throw makes the sde more visable. From what I read the ae500 is better than z2 but has a long throw. The z2 is short but from the early data the tx-100 seems even shorter.

Leaf

Dan Hitchman

06-02-04, 04:12 AM

The Z2 has a slightly longer throw than the ae500.

cpc

06-02-04, 11:58 AM

Canadians are being fleeced all right. Its our small population. We don't have the market numbers to demand higher volume lower prices so manufacturers rip us off. Oh well. We'll wait and see what the price for the Hitachi is. Probably too high, but who knows.

Lou_1

06-02-04, 01:30 PM

Home-1 (TX-10) original MSRP was U.S. $1,799. While I have not recently checked prices, I purchased my Home-1 during the first month release here in U.S. for $1,199. That was a sale, I think average is/was more like $1,299.

Dear moderator, I know we are not supposed to discuss prices here. Please look at the context of this discussion and see that it has nothing to do with comparison shopping. Speculative analogy for an unreleased model is the focus. Prices are being offered as ratio reference points and no merchants are discussed. Hope this satisfies the rules.

~ Lou ~

cpc

06-02-04, 04:33 PM

Yeah, I'm not siting any dealers or retailers at all. Just talking about the rough retail street prices that all the dealers are selling for in the US and Canada. The average retail prices that most dealers are offering. The normal prices of the US and the sad high prices of Canada.

drace-nl

06-02-04, 06:40 PM

Originally posted by smyth22
This projector appears to have only a 1 year warranty. That seems to be out of step with most others.

I wonder where you got that information from.

According to http://live.hitachidigitalmedia.com/http://ebizwebprod.hitachi-eu.com:83/NASApp/DMG/faqs.jsp?firsttime=false&showdiscontinued=n&faqstypeid=6&faqsgroupid=-1&faqsproductid=-1 (sorry, in dutch; please use on line translator) the warranty for ALL Hitachi lcd projectors has been extended to 3 years as of August 1st, 2001. Also, bulb warranty extended to 6 months.

Next Monday, I'll visit a Dutch dealer's showroom to compare the Hitachi and the Z2 :) .
I can hardly wait ... (erhm, I'm new to pj's, so please don't expect a review :( )

Ursa

06-02-04, 08:05 PM

Just report back the best you can...we'll all use online translators! :D

(to correct for your enthusiasm/lack of experience...)

Later,
Bill

Durabolin

06-03-04, 06:15 AM

Seems like we still have a 1 year warranty in Australia.

Fidel rodriguez

06-03-04, 10:05 AM

Hello. this is off topic but I'm curious. Being in the united states, If I buy an Hitachi PJ-TX100 from a reseller in the UK, do I also pay VAT fees?

Durabolin

06-03-04, 10:09 AM

No i dont beleive you would. Its basically a domestic sales tax.

Grubert

06-03-04, 11:55 AM

Announced in America:

Press release (http://db.widescreenreview.com/weeknews/FMPro?-db=webnewsearch.fp5&-format=record%5fdetail.htm&-sortfield=rank&-op=cn&Type=Web%20News&Year=2004&Month=06&Day=02&-recid=41514&-find=)

But...

MSRP $3999? Are they on crack or what?? For that money you can buy two of them in Europe! What has this world come to??

madpoet

06-03-04, 12:13 PM

Well gang... sorry to say that this entire discussion needs to move to the bigger forum then. MSRP is out of our range, and thus out of our discussion area. Moving the thread now.

Lou_1

06-03-04, 12:14 PM

Grubert,
I do not know how reliable that source is... It is already the last month of "Q2" and the unit is not yet available. If the MSRP is correct and we apply the same ratio (SP/MSRP) that the Home-1 (TX-10) sells for {72% of MSRP) then the avg. selling price of the TX-100 will be more like $2,880.

While I have no desire to indicate anything against that source, as I know nothing of it or its reliability, it is possible that they are simply trying to get a jump on headlines. I just googled "hitachi PJ-TX100" and all hits were in countries other than U.S. Additionally, if Hitachi stays consistent with their marketing approach as applied to the Home-1 (TX-10), they will come out with a different model name - such as Home-2...

I suspect it is a bit early to draw any conclusions given the available information.

Just another $0.02
~ Lou ~

Lou_1

06-03-04, 12:17 PM

Madpoet,
Don't you think that move was a bit premature? One single MSRP quote from an unreliable source that doesn't even hit on google?

This is obviously a very popular and well read thread in the under $3500. I think you are a bit overzealous.

potus

06-03-04, 12:19 PM

And to think we all thought the Canada $3999 price was nuts! They have really outdone themselves! Based on current exchange rates, the US price is a full 36% HIGHER than the Canadian price!!!

They REALLY don't want to sell any of these here! I don't care HOW "Visually Stunning" they claim it is, it ain't movin at THAT price!

madpoet

06-03-04, 12:47 PM

It's an Hitachi press release. I'd have to assume they know the MSRP of their own product ;). And WSR is hardly "unreliable". Still, if it proves otherwise, I'd be happy to welcome it back to our forum.

Lou_1

06-03-04, 12:54 PM

Madpoet,
I am not sure it IS a Hitachi press release.

here are links to the Hitachi.us press release site and the Hitachi.com press release sites (as referenced in that previously posted link):
http://www.hitachi.us/Apps/hitachicom/content.jsp?GXHC_JSESSIONID=-375235903511515901&page=PressReleases/details/index.html&path=jsp/hitachi/aboutus/Press-Media/

http://www.hitachi.com/New/cnews/index.html

The PJ-TX100 is not listed.

Lou_1

06-03-04, 01:07 PM

Here is a link to Hitachi of North America PJ current models: http://www.hitachi.us/Apps/hitachicom/content.jsp?page=LCOSLCDProjectors/CurrentModels/index.html&level=2&section=LCOSLCDProjectors&parent=CurrentModels&nav=left&path=jsp/hitachi/forhome/DigitalMedia/&nId=iD
TX-100 is not listed.

I searched the Hitachi of North America site and the only press release I could find was for a commercial model CP-S235 and the release was dated 3/30/04 and the MSRP was $2995.

I am willing to concede that I may have missed it but I did not find anything from Hitachi that even mentions the TX-100.

Given the populatity of this thread and the lack of verification, I still think the move was over-zealous. If I am proven wrong, I will happily retract my comments.

madpoet

06-03-04, 01:15 PM

I highly doubt WSR is going to post fake press releases. You'll note Hitachi's press release section only goes up through May 25th. I'm not sure generally how long they take to update their own website. Personally, I think they are smoking crack if they think people will pay that much for that projector. Or even anywhere withing $1500.

Lou_1

06-03-04, 01:16 PM

PS. Will all those subscribed to this thread in the Under $3500 forum still get notified of new posts even in the moved thread or have they all been cut out unless they check the main "under..." page to see that the thread was moved? If they all lost that thread subscription notification, then over 11,000 reads with whatever % subscribed just got cut out of this discussion based on one piece of un-verifiable information.

potus

06-03-04, 01:20 PM

I have still been getting the email notifications, and will certainly keep monitoring this thread!

I'm also a little suspicious of the report. It's just a magazine, afterall. I'll bet someone saw the $3999 Canadian price, and incorrectly reported it as a US release.

Besides, as mentioned earlier, it won't be called "PJ-TX100" when (if?)released in US. It will be in the "HOME" line. So I think the article is in error in more than one way.

madpoet

06-03-04, 01:25 PM

Subscriptions hold no matter where itgets moved. I hope it was an article in error and not an official release. But for now we have to go on what we have, and what we have is a projector that seems like it belongs here rather than there.

potus

06-03-04, 01:33 PM

Maybe after it gets beat up badly here it will run back to the safety of the cheap forum with its tail between its legs!

There are so many better projectors in that price range. Matterhorn DLPs with Faroudja processing, etc... It's just NOT competitive at that price... I don't care how "visually stunning" they think it is.

dusk

06-03-04, 01:43 PM

Just to put another dent in everyone's day:
http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/040601/15282_1.html

I have to say that anything over 2K and it doesn't seem worth the price even for the slight picture improvements. Given the reports it does not improve on screen door, dust blobs etc. In Europe the thing is priced below Z2 and AE500 so why in the US would we suddenly pay more for it when we all know that? The lens is I grant you a nice flexible thing but the shift isn't as good as the Z2.

Now I think something that wasn't mentioned is how will this PJ look compared to the HS20 which is currently the high end of the low end HD PJ's. The slight improvement some have mentioned in the HS20 over Z2/AE500 certainly does not seem worth the 800-900+ bucks in price. If the PJ hits the streets about the same as the Home-1 did compared to its MSRP we're talking right on current HS20 prices which may be Hitachi's aim. Nice try but I don't think many are going to buy it knowing that the UK is getting it for way less. I hope we're not seeing typcial early adopter price gouging for the "rich" Americans.

Maltby

06-03-04, 01:50 PM

Since we have to go with what we have, lets go back to page 1 of the thread. KTAK saw a demo unit in a store in Japan and reported that it will sell in the $2000 range, starting on June 10th.

If it sells for MSRP of $3999 here in the States, fine. When the Panny 500 came out first in Japan, plenty of people bought their PJs over there, even with Japanese menus. Whats going to happen when the Hitachi comes out at half the price and in english?

Myself, and everyone else, will be buying them in Japan. And the $3999 price tag in the States will be irrelevant because nobody will be paying that price. I think the WSR release refers to Canada, or is mistaken, etc. I vote to put this thread back where it belongs.

dusk

06-03-04, 01:58 PM

I really hope(think) there was an error somewhere in the pricing given both the US and Canada have the same numerical MSRP even if actual comparable value is different.

Lou_1

06-03-04, 01:59 PM

Well, the Yahoo post certainly confirms what I had previously posted as "unconfirmed" - Thus I happily retract my previous "over-zealous" comments.

My apologies to Madpoet.
~ Lou ~

madpoet

06-03-04, 01:59 PM

The same release is linked above from a different site (Yahoo). If it is mistaken, then fine. But now we have 2 sources with the same press release saying $3999 MSRP. Our forum rules, btw, are generally based on U.S. MSRP since that is where they are located.

Edit- No need to apologize Lou. I still hope it is wrong.

JPinTO

06-03-04, 02:01 PM

http://home.businesswire.com/portal/site/home/index.jsp?epi-content=GENERIC&newsId=20040601005282&newsLang=en&beanID=202776713&viewID=news_view

Lou_1

06-03-04, 02:07 PM

All three posts look like pretty much the same release. I think it is kind of sad that three sources post what is supposed to be a "Hitachi" press release and Hitachi does not have any mention on their sites!

It could also be sources merely posting copies (correct or not, verified or not). If the information is MSRP incorrect, this certainly says something of the reliability of these posting sources. I think when I see it on Projectorcentral.com I will believe it!

ssj2

06-03-04, 02:18 PM

A quick Google search shows street prices in the UK at less than half the supposed US $3,999 msrp.

JPinTO

06-03-04, 02:46 PM

Originally posted by Lou_1
All three posts look like pretty much the same release. I think it is kind of sad that three sources post what is supposed to be a "Hitachi" press release and Hitachi does not have any mention on their sites!

Not surprising--- news sites post the latest stuff. Manufacturer websites are usually behind the times.

cpc

06-03-04, 02:55 PM

The MSRP that Furious mentioned and the MSRP I was told by a Hitachi dealer for the PJ-TX100 is $3999 CDN in Canada which last time I checked, is equal to a $2936 USD MSRP. That newswire thing really doesn't make much sense from my CDN dealer communications.

Furious? Any feedback on your end?

This is getting weirder by the post. So that link shows an MSRP of $3999 USD. I wonder if the Canadian retailers have been quoting me with the USD MSRP. If that is true, then wow, thats priced way out there.

I believe that the Hitachi dealers in Canada are going to be informed about the Hitachi in such a way to compare the PJ-TX100 with the Sony HS-20, Sharp XV-Z200, Sanyo Z2 and the Panasonic AE500. Now, that doesn't tell me much about the expected MSRP.

Also, its weird that the 100 is in the UK before Japan. Japan expects them June 10th, as we know, and they speculate, basically guess that the street price could be roughly $2K USD or less.

And we wait.... :p

Ursa

06-03-04, 05:12 PM

The pricing makes sense if it is going to compete head-on with the Epson 500, but if, as seems more likely, it would be better aimed at the Z2/AE500, then there will be very few dealers who sell any in the US. My guess is that most savvy buyers will be contacting "over there" for these units. Especially since the Japanes MSRP is about $1500 less than the US MSRP...

Later,
Bill

hitchfan

06-03-04, 05:15 PM

I notice the English language brochure doesn't picture the PJ-TX 100 ceiling mounted anywhere but only placed on a coffee-table, a side table and in a bookcase. I'm sure it can be ceiling mounted, of course, but wouldn't showing it ceiling mounted in a dedicated HT be more indicative of a higher priced unit and showing it placed on a coffee-table more for the casual user and, therefore, targeted to consumers less likely to make a serious HT $$$ investment? Could mean a big drop below the MSRP. Just a thought.

I see that the lamp may be getting a 6 month warranty. That's certainly helpful, but, as it is with the Z2, no mention of lamp life expectations in the specs worries me. Anyone know what to expect on lamp-life and replacement costs for this model?

Lou_1

06-03-04, 05:30 PM

Still think that price is a mistake. For whatever it is worth, the lamp life in the Home-1 (TX-10) is 2000 hours and the replacement cost is $199 U.S.

Durabolin

06-03-04, 05:46 PM

It makes absolutely no sense to be priced as stated in that PR. It is neither consistent with global pricing as reflected in Japan, Australia and Europe nor is it consistent with Hitachi U.S pricing for other AV products such as Plasmas.

I maintain it is incorrect. Either that or the guy heading up Hitachi Projection in the U.S is getting paid under the table by Sanyo and Panasonic.

Given the global nature of this forum i think this thread should be kept in the Under 3.5K forum as this reflects the pricing found everywhere BUT the US and probably the U.S also unless we have moved to the twilight zone :)

Kroot

06-03-04, 06:07 PM

To give you some input on price in Europe - in Estonia this unit MSRP is around $2200 (and we always have higher prices then for example Germany/UK).
Replacement lamp cost MSRP is around $250.

drace-nl

06-03-04, 06:38 PM

My Dutch dealer's price for the TX100 is 1799 EUR or 2160 USD (1 EUR = 1.2 USD).
Replacement lamp like 250 EUR (300 USD).

madpoet

06-03-04, 06:54 PM

If you guys want it moved back, ask the mods here. I don't mind, but the fact is that the only MSRP for the US that we have to go on is in that press release.

-MP

cpc

06-03-04, 07:06 PM

I'm cool with having it where-ever, but I do suspect it will be lower than $3500 USD MSRP.

wixy

06-03-04, 09:34 PM

just wondering, what is the lamp life for the tx100? I dont think ive seen it stated anywhere.

Ursa

06-03-04, 09:37 PM

3,999 hours? :D

...but only in Canada!

Later,
Bill

Shedrock

06-03-04, 10:13 PM

If I was to import one of these projectors from England to America (in order to save some money), would all of my movies play back with an English accent?

On second thought, I just remembered that the sound comes through the speakers --so, I should be all good! I guess I answered my own question. :)

Jcam9

06-03-04, 10:33 PM

Along with what Shedrock was getting at, what are the potential cons to buying from the UK? I suppose dealer warranty would be one? If you purchased the extended Hitachi warranty could you not have it serviced stateside at an authorized repair center?

Just wondering, since the considerable cost savings have peaked my interest:)

Ktak

06-03-04, 10:34 PM

Originally posted by cpc
Japan expects them June 10th, as we know, and they speculate, basically guess that the street price could be roughly $2K USD or less.

And we wait.... :p

Pre-orders are already being taken for a street price of well under $2,000 U.S. It's being sold for a few hundred dollars over the Z2, but this price is likely to fall after it's been out a few months.

Furious

06-03-04, 10:51 PM

I was talking with another of the buyers at work today after we saw the press release. We speculated that it may either be an extremely infalted SRP that has little relationship to the actual dealer cost/street price or indicactive of a pending price hike in Canada. The consensus was that if that USD figure is accurate we'll definitely see an adjustment to CDN SRP. We're up North, so our pricing has to go up North as well :p Hitachi is still waffling on the price a bit here with no firm commital to a specific dealer cost/SRP as of Wednesday other than the 3499-3999 they had tossed around. If they do match the US pricing that will give you a bit of an idea of how much margin they make on dealer sales...

The US retail puts the 100 in the HS20/LPX510/TW500 level of pricing. On paper you might slot the Hitachi in that group based on feature/specs. In either case I'm keeping a close eye on this one as I'd love to get ahold of a sample to play with. If it's anything like the LPX510 I'm sampling right now it could be a killer piece if the SRP stays down at the intial quotes which put it at a cool $1000 below the LPX510/HS20/TW500 before SRP adjustments.

Originally posted by cpc
The MSRP that Furious mentioned and the MSRP I was told by a Hitachi dealer for the PJ-TX100 is $3999 CDN in Canada which last time I checked, is equal to a $2936 USD MSRP. That newswire thing really doesn't make much sense from my CDN dealer communications.

Furious? Any feedback on your end?

This is getting weirder by the post. So that link shows an MSRP of $3999 USD. I wonder if the Canadian retailers have been quoting me with the USD MSRP. If that is true, then wow, thats priced way out there.

I believe that the Hitachi dealers in Canada are going to be informed about the Hitachi in such a way to compare the PJ-TX100 with the Sony HS-20, Sharp XV-Z200, Sanyo Z2 and the Panasonic AE500. Now, that doesn't tell me much about the expected MSRP.

Also, its weird that the 100 is in the UK before Japan. Japan expects them June 10th, as we know, and they speculate, basically guess that the street price could be roughly $2K USD or less.

And we wait.... :p :p

danam

06-04-04, 06:48 AM

wow incredible strategy ! :o

the LPX510 and TW500 both have DCDi chip included ... and (i think) motorised zoom.
2 features the TX100 doesnt have.

the TX100 is more to compete with Z2 and PTAE500 and TW200 than LPX510 and TW500 ...

anyway i think the 510 and 500 are overpriced nowadays for LCD technology projectors ...

and I'm still stunned when watching a movie on the TX100 ;)

cpc

06-04-04, 09:57 AM

Well, everybody, Canadians in particular, email Hitachi and ask that they price the Hitachi to compete with the Sanyo Z2. Try to get as many people to email them as possible. It couldn't hurt. Simply state that you're shopping for a projector and will buy the Sanyo Z2 unless Hitachi has an alternative to offer at a competetive price.

Hawkson

06-04-04, 10:16 AM

I ventured over here from the under 3.5k forum asking about the TX100. I was hoping to find the TX100 at Z2 prices(as all of you are apparently) only to find the same thing I have found in the 4805 thread-speculation:(

I can wait for the fog to clear as long as I know how long to wait for. When exactly is the TX100 supposed to come out in the US and other then KTAK, who has seen the TX100?

Grubert

06-04-04, 10:27 AM

Originally posted by Hawkson
I ventured over here from the under 3.5k forum asking about the TX100. I was hoping to find the TX100 at Z2 prices(as all of you are apparently) only to find the same thing I have found in the 4805 thread-speculation:(

Well I'd tend to consider a press release a step above speculation. :D

When exactly is the TX100 supposed to come out in the US
Second quarter 2004 per the aforementioned PR. That means by June 30.

and other then KTAK, who has seen the TX100?
About a hundred French and Germans are watching one in their homes as we speak.

Orangelo

06-04-04, 11:07 AM

Originally posted by Grubert
MSRP $3999? Are they on crack or what?? For that money you can buy two of them in Europe! What has this world come to??

Or you can buy two firehawks in the US :D

Ok, here is the deal... Mr. Grubert and myself will happily send a 2 units to the US (that's 8k worth in PJs) in exchange of 4 Firehawk screens (surely less than 6k if you shop wisely). It will be 92" for me. What screen size are you projecting on, Grubert?

As for the remaining two, we will sell it in the Spanish forum for 1.5k each and split the cash :D

madpoet

06-04-04, 11:17 AM

Heh, I'm all for a free market society ;)

Grubert

06-04-04, 11:22 AM

I'll have an 80", thanks.

We also accept payment in iScan or Lumagen DVI scalers. :D

manufanatic

06-04-04, 11:26 AM

Hopefully this is within the rules I found a pdf on the Hitachi at this website

http://www.shootandshow.co.uk/hitachi-pjtx100

madpoet

06-04-04, 11:51 AM

A better link:

http://www.shootandshow.co.uk/docs/Hitachi_PJ-TX100.pdf

darni

06-04-04, 01:38 PM

Here in Finland this Hitachi PJ-TX100 is priced on the web for cheapest I found 1558.40EUR (Including 22% taxes) that is 1901.72USD. And it is in stock! I wish my birthday was sooner :( I am getting it for my 30th birthday present, so I have to wait for it a couple of months still.

cpc

06-04-04, 02:00 PM

Any reviews or shootouts coming out that compare the Hitachi PJ-TX100 with the Sanyo Z2 and Panasonic PT500 ?? In addition to the final street price in Canada and the US, we need to know how the Hitachi 100 compares with the sub $2K USD alternatives.

Wouldn't the Europe Hitachi PJ-TX100's be 220 volt, right? The PDF from Hitachi Europe LTD says 100-120V/220-240V. Does that mean that they are like the orignal AE100 and have a universal switching 100-240 volt power supply? That would leave an option for us North Americans :)

Diarmuid

06-04-04, 03:14 PM

Does anyone know if it does PAL 50hz via DVI?

Grubert

06-04-04, 04:12 PM

Originally posted by cpc
Any reviews or shootouts coming out that compare the Hitachi PJ-TX100 with the Sanyo Z2 and Panasonic PT500 ??

See post #129 of this thread. According to the original poster who compared the TX100 with the Z2, the TX100 was brighter, had more contrast, more accurate and vivid colours, sharper optics, better menus and wider zoom range. The Z2 had wider lens shift range and less noise.

Wouldn't the Europe Hitachi PJ-TX100's be 220 volt, right? The PDF from Hitachi Europe LTD says 100-120V/220-240V. Does that mean that they are like the orignal AE100 and have a universal switching 100-240 volt power supply? That would leave an option for us North Americans :)

Yes, universal switching power supply.

Originally posted by cpc
Does anyone know if it does PAL 50hz via DVI?

Affirmative on that.

cpc

06-04-04, 04:36 PM

I'm aware of the original posters comparison and that is why I'm thinking of buying a Hitachi TX100 instead of a Sanyo Z2.

More feedback from others would be best. The more input and feedback from people viewing the projector, the better, and comparisons with the Sanyo Z2 and Panny 500 are key. So individual people comparing the projectors, and of course, reviews from places are good too. Universal switching power supply sounds good. UK/Europe or Japan sourcing will still be an option. English OSD is a factor for Japan sourcing though.

madpoet

06-04-04, 06:17 PM

Geez CPC, you change your mind more times than my wife at a dress store ;)

Acropora

06-04-04, 06:21 PM

Was wondering, if you order off the internet from a company based in Europe or Japan, what do you end up paying in import taxes? ie. what gets added to price to get it to your front door? 10%, 20%?

tsteves

06-04-04, 06:48 PM

Also shipping will be expensive. What kind of shipping options do european and japanese resellers force you to use?

Durabolin

06-04-04, 07:34 PM

Im really enjoying the irony of seeing US residents having to ponder the option of importing a product that for once is considerably cheaper in other countries and not just Japan :)

As an Australian resident I have to do it all the time and its a pain in the ass but still worth doing if the savings are significant. Problem is you guys are used to the lowest prices, 1 day free shipping to the door, no taxes, no import duties, no extended shipping distances, can generally find very good customer service and did i mention the lowest prices ? Count yourselves lucky to be living in the largest and most competitive consumer market on the planet.

cpc

06-04-04, 07:55 PM

Hey, I made a decision recently! I bought a Panasonic DVD F87K. My friend is likely to buy my older Panasonic CV51.

I won't be buying anything bigger until I have better cash situation and until the Hitachi comes out. I change my mind a zillion times. I have "I must get the absolute best I can afford" affliction. So if the Hitachi really is an improvement over the Sanyo and Panny, I'll go that route. I haven't been in-decisive, I've just been financially challenged this year. I'm keeping my pulse on the projector market so when my work and finances are ok, I'll make a choice then. Even if the Hitachi is much better, but I could only afford the Z2 or 500, I'm sure either one will be great. Heck, I've enjoyed my AE100 and L200 thus far. Just want higher contrast and less screendoor.

manufanatic

06-04-04, 08:34 PM

Originally posted by madpoet
A better link:

http://www.shootandshow.co.uk/docs/Hitachi_PJ-TX100.pdf

Thanks mr poet;)

Sumptious looking PJ isnt it:p

potus

06-04-04, 09:57 PM

Originally posted by Acropora
Was wondering, if you order off the internet from a company based in Europe or Japan, what do you end up paying in import taxes? ie. what gets added to price to get it to your front door? 10%, 20%?
The price to import direct from Japan WILL be less than $2k, all taxes, shipping, etc. included. Probably even lower following initial introduction.

There are considerable downsides, however. You will be buying a unit meant for Japan market. There may or may not be power-supply issues (you will likely have to buy a different cable, at the least) You don't get an English manual (although you may be able to find a .pdf),. Onscreen display will default to Japanese (probably easy to change..) and most importantly, you don't get a US warranty. You might be able to arrange warranty service via the retailer, but you will have to pay round-trip shipping to Japan, which can be quite expensive, and somewhat of a hassle.

I would hold off for the official US release offering. Don't be too concerned with MSRP. In many cases this is a fantasy price anyways. The market will determine a REAL price. We know there is a LOT of margin built into that MSRP, so it's VERY likely street price will be considerably lower.

Zippo

06-05-04, 04:51 AM

darni: could you send me a PM about which shop in Finland that carry TX100 and have those low prices?

Waltari

06-05-04, 05:52 PM

German idealo.de (the german pricewatch) lists PJ-TX100, cheapest 1999 EUR which includes 17,5% VAT. So the Finnish pricing must be a mistake. I emailed the Finnish importer and they told me the price with VAT 0% would be 1590. That would put it to the same price range as Z-2 and AE-500 here, under 2000 euros including 22% VAT.

darni

06-05-04, 06:29 PM

Originally posted by Waltari
German idealo.de (the german pricewatch) lists PJ-TX100, cheapest 1999 EUR which includes 17,5% VAT. So the Finnish pricing must be a mistake. I emailed the Finnish importer and they told me the price with VAT 0% would be 1590. That would put it to the same price range as Z-2 and AE-500 here, under 2000 euros including 22% VAT.

Just looked from biggest finnish computer & peripherals importers web page (GNT Finland) their price for it including 22% VAT is 1519.10EUR (exact price for retailers varies depending on their price class), so if your price class for projectors is the best, I think it would be less than 1500EUR. Finnish pricewatch list PJ-TX100 as follows: (mbnet.fi/hintaseuranta) and it is in stock!

Cheapest: 1558EUR
Most expensive: 1749EUR

Please remember that these are home computer stores, their margin is around 10%. And computer peripherals importers margins are lower than electronics importers. There is two importers for this projector, Aronet esitysyhtiöt Oy and GNT Finland Ltd. which imports computer related stuff.

So I belive, that you have mailed this Aronet? My friend has already bought his PJ from GNT directly (he works in a retail store) for the price of around 1500EUR including taxes. Don't know for sure if he has taken it to home yet (he hasn't responded to my message).

Acropora

06-06-04, 11:40 AM

Well, I went to mbnet.fi/hintaseuranta hoping to just buy one already but can't read finnish. Oh well. Hope it'll be released here in the US in the next couple months or will just be buying the HS20 or 8700.

Jcam9

06-06-04, 01:51 PM

My stepmom is from England and visits relatives every year so it should be no problem for myself to obtain one, if the pricing plays out as definately a much cheaper alternative to the US MSRP.

I am just a bit concerned about how the warranty will work buying overseas.

Zippo

06-06-04, 03:55 PM

I have seen both the Hitachi and the H30 but not at the same ocassion so I have not had the possibility to really compare them.

The H30 has really good black levels! Unfortunately it is not that quiet and does not seem to have lens shift which I think is a superb feature.

When I read about people choosing H30 they have seen Panasonic AE500 and Sanyo Z2 and say that the H30 wins hands down when it comes to picture quality (blacks, colors, etc).

How about you people out there? Have you seen both DLP and LCD and still choose LCD? Is the difference that big in DLPs favor? Is it rainbows, the lower resolution, the noise that keeps you from choosing DLP? Or is it that you think that the picture quality, colors etc are better with LCD?

I have a 4:3, 800x600, LCD projector and feel the "upgrade devil" whispering in my ear. I am really keen on the TX100 but am wondering if H30 is the way to a better cinema experience.

I want darker blacks, less noise (I have 32 dB right now), and less screen door then my current setup.

What do you think?

benf72

06-06-04, 04:44 PM

If Hitachi Canada insists on overpricing their projectors in Canada compared to Europe, I wonder if there is a business model in importing these projectors from Europe, without the warranty of course.

I for one would be willing to sacrifice the warranty if I could get this projector for the same price as the Z2, which would save me over $1,200 CAN.

cpc

06-06-04, 09:13 PM

With the H30, resolution is not a big deal, although screen door could be, but for some, rainbows simply make the H30 a non starter. I for one haven't rule it out completely, but its highly unlikely to work for me because I am extremely sensitive to rainbows. Watching power point presentations on an X1 makes my head throb.

I'm all for exploring all the opportunities to do with the Hitachi PJ-TX100. While I twiddle my thumbs waiting to hear what the actual street/retailer price will be, I will email and contact Hitachi Canada to let them know that I am very interested in the TX100, and will buy it if its fairly priced, in the context of the world prices, otherwise, I'll import one or buy a Z2 or PT500 instead.

Shedrock

06-07-04, 03:43 AM

A "well known" projector export site from Japan has added this pj to their inventory at a price less than $2k including shipping to the United States. I have never used this business, and certainly don't endorse them in any way. I just mentioned them because it looks like this thread will be moved back to the "under $3500" forum sooner or later.

madpoet

06-07-04, 08:32 AM

Shed, I don't see where it's moving back unless Hitachi lowers their MSRP in the US.

Emmenem

06-07-04, 08:38 AM

I want to buy my first pj and I am interested in Hitachi PJ-TX 100. What do you think about it? Is it a

good pj? Can I remap 1:1 the matrix with my HTPC without problems? Does it work @50HZ?
Where can I find some (good) screenshots?
Thanks to everyone!

Grubert

06-07-04, 10:29 AM

Originally posted by Emmenem
I want to buy my first pj and I am interested in Hitachi PJ-TX 100. What do you think about it? Is it a good pj?

I haven't seen one yet but it apparently is.

Can I remap 1:1 the matrix with my HTPC without problems?
Yes, tested.

Does it work @50HZ?
Yes, tested.

Where can I find some (good) screenshots?

Look here. (http://www.homecinema-fr.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=29743956)

dusk

06-07-04, 11:32 AM

Ok I have found a UK company that will ship internationally. They will only ship overseas with a direct bank transfer due to fears of credit card fraud. I worked out 2 Day shipping via UPS which is about $80-90(retail) to east coast ie: would be here Wednesday if shipped today. The dollar is still kinda weak but the exchange still puts this in Z2/AE500 territory or below. The price at this company is basically equal to the going price at other online UK retailers such as Ivojo and Nexnix. Though I am not sure what the duty would be on importing this from the UK.

http://www.progressive-av.com

yipchunyu

06-07-04, 11:37 AM

Originally posted by Grubert
I haven't seen one yet but it apparently is.

[B]
Yes, tested.

[B]
Yes, tested.

[B]
Look here. (http://www.homecinema-fr.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=29743956)

the screen looks bad

Jcam9

06-07-04, 01:28 PM

Dusk, did you find out any warranty details with this option? I contacted one company in the UK and they said

"I would contact Hitachi to clarify this. It is my understanding that you can register the projector in the US and utilize a service centre there. It is still worth contacting Hitachi though as they may change the warranty terms once it is in the US (in previous experiences it has been downgraded)."

I would pay a couple hundred more for an extended warranty if this was the case. I spoke to an authorized Hitachi projector service center here in the US and they said terms are up to the manufacturer which I am still waiting to hear back from. He said Hitachi is top notch for service though.

Guess I am jumping the gun a little and need to be more patient. Have to see what the actual street price here will be first :)

dusk

06-07-04, 02:23 PM

No unfortunately I haven't jumped too deep into the details. I was in search of a retailer that would sell internationally which was quoted online. As for the warranty I assumed there would be some issues there. Currently I am also awaiting the actual street price of this PJ and some more hands on reviews.

cpc

06-07-04, 08:49 PM

Those screen shots look ok, as far as screen shots go.

benf72

06-07-04, 09:07 PM

Originally posted by dusk
[B]Ok I have found a UK company that will ship internationally. They will only ship overseas with a direct bank transfer due to fears of credit card fraud. I worked out 2 Day shipping via UPS which is about $80-90(retail) to east coast ie: would be here Wednesday if shipped today. The dollar is still kinda weak but the exchange still puts this in Z2/AE500 territory or below. The price at this company is basically equal to the going price at other online UK retailers such as Ivojo and Nexnix. Though I am not sure what the duty would be on importing this from the UK.

You are right.. This puts it right in the Z2 price range, even with $100 shipping.

I'm going to use this site for proof of unfair pricing in an email to Hitachi Canada if they plan on gouging Canadians.

I'm going to contact Canada customs, and I'll post the results of any duties involved.

KCK7

06-07-04, 09:36 PM

I googled the PJ a few days ago but did not write down the UK prices, and I could be mistaken, but are they a little higher than they were then? I seem to remember under 1000 quid including VAT.

Also, I would imagine we in the US would not pay VAT?

I guess getting it from the UK is preferable to Japan, as it is easier to read British than Japanese. Hearing some of those accents, however, is another matter.... anyone watch "Billy Elliott"? :D

Yeah, I know, chauvinistic Americans...

How about the voltage difference and the power cord config?? Need an adaptor or is the former internally switchable?

Jcam9

06-07-04, 09:57 PM

KCK7, you would not have to pay VAT. I spoke to a UK dealer today(the one mentioned earlier) and he confirmed this. He said if I used a friend or relative in the UK to register it I would receive a 3 yr warranty and only have to pay shipping back to have it serviced. I am even more interested now:)

Price was very good, well under 2k.

I believe it is switchable power supply but have not confirmed this yet.

Jcam9

06-07-04, 09:58 PM

Hope I am not bending forum rules, trying to be vague about the exact pricing and such.

Jcam9

06-07-04, 10:03 PM

KCK7, I just sent you a pm.

swb

06-08-04, 02:50 AM

Having looked at several projectors over the past few years, I've yet to find one that doesn't have a multi-voltage power supply, i.e. they will happily handle 110 as well as 240v. I'd therefore be very surprised if this one was different.

The socket on the projector also seems to be standard, using a 3 pin type. I'm sure you've all seen them before. In the UK at least, these can be picked up for a couple of pounds, so I'd imagine they are available in the US/Canada for a few $$.

swb

06-08-04, 02:52 AM

Sorry, should have also said that in general they automatically accept the voltage you put in them, they are not "switchable" in the sense that you need to manually adjust it to the right voltage.

Of course, as ever, YMMV.

Jcam9

06-08-04, 03:26 AM

Is there any other concerns with buying the UK version. Has nothing to do with the PAL format over there correct? The projector scales the source signal either way to display it at its maximum resolution right?

For some reason this seems a little risky but the only problem could be the warranty and I think I may have that covered. What am I missing?

Grubert

06-08-04, 03:44 AM

No problem, the projector accepts NTSC interlaced and progressive.

Dead-pixel coverage could also be a problem. You should try to get the retailer to check the unit for dead pixels before shipping.

Edit to add areadvd has done a preview of the TX100 (full test to come later). See here: http://www.areadvd.de/hardware/Hitachi_PJ-TX_100.shtml

cpc

06-08-04, 10:16 AM

This may not be especially new news, but it sounds more official now.

This just in, an example from a Canadian Hitachi dealer I've been communicating with back and forth via email:

PJ-TX100 will be avail in July at a price of 3995$ CAD at most local dealer.
My initial price will probably be 3750$.

If you want to pre-order... I will do a special pre-order price of 3495$ for
a very limited time (the next two weeks).

Do not hesitate to share that information.

Not a dealer price posting cause its not a reality yet, just a prediction on his part, and I haven't said which dealer, just an example of what the Canadian MSRP/street prices are looking like they'll end up as.

Anybody hear from any US Hitachi retailers or dealers yet on their street prices?

So as far as I'm concerned, its a no go on that information alone. I'll wait and see how it performs and how people like it in general, in case I suddenly acquire an extra $1K CDN that I don't need :p but I think its safe to say that if they stick with that price, any North American Projector purchases made by me this year will be limited to either of the Z2 or the PT500. This opens up the import market again, as Europe, UK and Japan will likely be the viable options. I may consider that, but for whats it worth, unless the Hitachi has a really large and obviously noticable inprovement in contrast ratio and or black level, then I don't know if its worth the hassle. I guess some pioneers here will import and report back.

As a side note, I think its safe to say that the US MSRP will not be over $3.5K USD. Only time will tell.