New high end universal from Marantz - DV9500

[TauRus]

Marantz Japan announced a new universal DVD player DV9500.
In brief:
- HDMI/D2/Component/S-Video/Composite video interface
- digital coax/optical/analog 5.1 audio interface
- DD / DTS / DTS24/96 / Dolby Headphone onboard decoder
- 14bit/216MHz video DAC
- Crystal CS4398 24 bit/192 KHz audio DAC
- Cirrus Logic 32 bit DSP engine
- effective audio frequency response 4 Hz - 88 KHz
- s/n 130 dB
- 110 dB dynamic range
- THD 0.0008%
- weight 18.7 lb
- MSRP (Japan) $1400 !!!!!!!!!
- expected to ship - July 2004
I will impatiently wait for its release in US. Sounds like a great unit.

[kmmd]

Very nice! Is this the replacement for the DV8400? Will it upscale to 720p/1080i?

[TauRus]

Here is the link with the specs on the Japanese website:
http://www.marantz.jp/he/news/press/dv9500.shtml
The specs do not seem to mention any HD resolutions.
I read that DV9500 will use the same transport as used on the dedicated SACD player Marantz SA8400.

[jhchen]

It will, based on the web announcement. It will out put 720P/1080i via HDMI, using 10 bit video processing, assume it is the same solution on the 969AVi

JHC

Originally posted by kmmd
Very nice! Is this the replacement for the DV8400? Will it upscale to 720p/1080i?

[Kevin C Brown]

Shoot, I was hoping for something other than Cirrus DACs, and something other than a Pioneer based player... Even Pioneers use Burr Browns. (I'm just not a big fan of Cirrus.)

[YvesC]

What about iLink? :confused:

[jolaca]

I do not understand why a new Marantz should be similar to a Pioneer.
Marantz now is owned by a holding that includes Denon (and not Pioneer)

[kmmd]

Thanks for the info TauRus and jhchen!

YvesC posted:
What about iLink?
It looks like this player will not have it, just like the other Marantz universal/high-resolution audio players. I'm also wondering why you would want to bypass the incredible specs of the CS 4398 DAC's (http://www.cirrus.com/en/pubs/proDatasheet/CS4398-2.pdf) and the well-known very good analog output stages of Marantz players? After all, thanks to a certain forum member and his website, did you know that the Pioneer Elite receivers, 49TXi (AX10i) AND 59TXi (AX10Ai), share the same DAC's...the Burr Brown 1704's? Here is a link to the specs page from Nov. 1998: Burr Brown 1704 DAC spec page (http://www.schuro.de/Daten/Burr%20Brown/PCM1704.pdf).

[TauRus]

Originally posted by Kevin C Brown
Shoot, I was hoping for something other than Cirrus DACs, and something other than a Pioneer based player... Even Pioneers use Burr Browns. (I'm just not a big fan of Cirrus.)

Kevin, what makes you think this universal is based on a Pioneer transpot? I guess you are assuming this based on precedence that older Marantz universal players like DV8300 and DV8400 were built on Pioneer chassis. As I mentioned before, this DV9500 is using the same transport as a dedicated SACD player (not universal) SA8400 which is a very different unit than DV8400. TO compare, look at these links below:

DV8400 -
http://www.marantz.jp/he/products/hometheater/dvd/dv8400/index.shtml

SA8400 - http://www.marantz.jp/he/products/audio/sacd/sa8400/index.shtml
I have to be honest, I have no clue what transport/chassis the SA8400 is based upon but it looks very different from DV8400. I am not claiming it is not using Pioneer, I am just saying let's not rush to conclusions based on past experiences. This time it might be a different story.

[Shane Martin]

Interesting. I wonder if it will have the chroma bug like the previous Marantz players?

[bubbawilly]

I'd rather see a Pioneer transport than a Denon. Much quieter, and far more reliable.

I guess that we'll see if this is based on their SACD player. Is that a Philips transport???

[Megalodon]

I just bought the DV8400 two weeks ago for a GREAT price. I love it, but I wonder if I should return it and wait for this one. Questions:

1) I wonder how did they improve the audio specs S/N ratio, and Dynamic range??

2) Does the dv9500, share the same Cirrus Logic chipset as the DV8400?

3) What does a July arrival timeframe in Japan translate into for America?

Jason

[kmmd]

Hi Jason,

The answer to 1.) is the use of different DAC's. After some searching, I came upon this Korean webpage: http://www.marantz.co.kr/shop/step1.html?number=175. Copy and paste this link and allow Babel Fish to translate from Korean to English: AltaVista Babel Fish translation (http://world.altavista.com/). Some of the translation comes out funny, but the info on the DAC is there. The DV8400 uses the CS4392 DAC (http://www.cirrus.com/en/pubs/proDatasheet/cs4392-2.pdf). Comparing the two datsheets shows the difference in dynamic range and THD + N specs. BTW, according to this, Cirrus Logic Audio/Video Mixed-Signal Processing Components page (http://www.cirrus.com/en/products/pro/areas/mixedsig_av.html), the CS4398 is their "Flagship Stereo D/A Converter with DSD Support."

[Megalodon]

Hey Ken, thanks for the info.

Honestly, I'm perfectly happy with the DV8400 sound especially with my Outlaw Audio ICBM, but I'm tempted to upgrade to the latest DAC techonology!! But where does one stop? It seems it has some niftly native SACD functions in the newer DAC.

I wonder if the DV9500 has the same limited Bass Management, as the DV8400.

Jason

[sasabune]

Anyone have thoughts on how it will compare to the Denon 5900?

[Kevin C Brown]

Taurus- The SA8400 has the drawer on the left, and the DV9500 has the drawer in the center. Obviously that can be re-engineered, but why change it then?

And,

It will out put 720P/1080i via HDMI, using 10 bit video processing, assume it is the same solution on the 969AVi

The 969AVi is a Pioneer. And the 59AVi uses 24/192 BBs, not the 1704 (which are 24/96).

But if it doesn't have i-link, maybe that's a clue it isn't related to a Pioneer.

[TauRus]

Originally posted by Kevin C Brown
Taurus- The SA8400 has the drawer on the left, and the DV9500 has the drawer in the center. Obviously that can be re-engineered, but why change it then?
Kevin, as far as I am concerned, location of the drawer has little bearing on the quality of the unit - it could be in the center or on the either side - its a pure design decision (perhaps to match the design of the matching receivers and other separates?.
Also, from what they wrote in the release I deduced they are using some advanced audio algorythms/ technologies that were previously implemented on the high end unit DV12S2. Not sure what they actually referred to, hopefully we will get some more information once this player is released on the NA market.

[jhchen]

Hi Kevin,

Based on my understanding of DV8400, Marantz took the transport and video section from Pio, used their own analog out put (HDAM).
I'm assuming Marantz did it again with DV9500, they didn't just re-bezel the 969AVi.

The i-link is a separate broad based on the TI chip, they can choose not to adapt it, perhaps due to cost and license issue.

The DAC are usually with the analog out put stage, so it is matter of laying out another board for the DAC/analog out stage.

JHC

Originally posted by Kevin C Brown
Taurus- The SA8400 has the drawer on the left, and the DV9500 has the drawer in the center. Obviously that can be re-engineered, but why change it then?

And,



The 969AVi is a Pioneer. And the 59AVi uses 24/192 BBs, not the 1704 (which are 24/96).

But if it doesn't have i-link, maybe that's a clue it isn't related to a Pioneer.

[kmmd]

sasabune asked:
Anyone have thoughts on how it will compare to the Denon 5900?
This is a difficult question to answer, but I will give it a try. Also, please remember that Jeff Talmadge has stated in another thread that the 5900's replacement, the 5910, will be released in September.

In comparing DAC's, I believe that they are very close, but the slight edge goes with the BB 1790's in the 5900 IMO. However, I think that where the major difference lies is in the analog stages. The Marantz uses, as jhchen posted and I agree, its "proprietary HDAM output devices" (quoted from Marantz website) which replaces op amps. Therefore, sorry fellow 5900 owners, I think that the overall sound quality will favor the Marantz. Again, without a direct side-by-side comparison, this is my opinion and my $0.02.

Kevin posted:
And the 59AVi uses 24/192 BBs, not the 1704 (which are 24/96).
Hi Kevin! So let me get this straight for the people who are using iLink...they are paying for better and newer DAC's in the player , bypassing them due to iLink, and still may be getting better sound? Could it be that other elements/stages are important also such as the power supplies, clocks, AND the analog stages (in the analog output of the player and analog ins/outs of the receiver/prepro)? Now, what if we were to mod those, take advantage of the DAC's, and...

Food for thought.

[dave7]

Ken,

I agree with you regarding iLink. It almost seems what many people really want is a pre/pro with a universal player built-in. What happened to separates?

Although - iLink could provide an opportunity for someone to produce a powerful outboard High-res audio DAC...couldn't it?

[TauRus]

Originally posted by jhchen
Hi Kevin,

Based on my understanding of DV8400, Marantz took the transport and video section from Pio, used their own analog out put (HDAM).
I'm assuming Marantz did it again with DV9500, they didn't just re-bezel the 969AVi.
JHC

JHC, the press release mentions SA8400 High End dedicated SACD player), not DV8400 (mid-tier universal DVD player). These are completely different beasts. I will be very surprised if SA8400 has anything common with DV8400. Look up the links I provided above, they have the specs and photos. So, again, I think unless we have credible information that this player was built on any of the Pioneer chassis (which is not a bad thing either), let us not speculate about it and confuse ourselves.
Over there in Taiwan you will probably hear more and sooner about this unit than we here. I will really appreciate if you will kindly share some facts with us.

[sergiohm]

What model is that SA8400 ? Is it a new one as well ? The dedicated SACD player in production in the US is the SA8260 and this one has nothing to do with the DV8300/8400 and sounds much better (but is it because of the DACs, architecture or is it because it is a dedicated audio player only?).
Marantz is also producing the SA14v2 which is a 2-channel SACD only but an even better player than the SA8260, it even has balanced outputs.
I forgot to mention the SA8260 has a "temperamental" transport, that is, sometimes it takes a minute or two to go from pause to play, sometimes more than that! I believe some folks had problems with the transport in the SA14 (but have not seen anything about the SA14v2 since it has been recently been brough back to US production).

[kmmd]

Hi Dave,

I'm sure you know all about proprietary discrete analog stages. :) How are you, and how is your Krell BTW?
Dave posted:
It almost seems what many people really want is a pre/pro with a universal player built-in. What happened to separates?
I agree. I think what changed my thinking is what I saw and heard at HE2003 last June. There were players (MSB) that also acted as pre-amps. And as I posted in another thread, this keeps the signal paths very short. Other players/DAC's such as MBL and Wadia can do this too. Here is a multi-channel player/preamp which I would love to audition: Muse Model Eleven (http://www.museelectronics.com/11.html).
Although - iLink could provide an opportunity for someone to produce a powerful outboard High-res audio DAC...couldn't it?
I love the way you think, i.e. processor, flagship DAC's, overbuilt power supply/supplies, fantastic and stable clock (slaving the transport clock) with a great analog output stage...possibly even tubes such as Dan Wright's (ModWright) with NO op amps! You may even want to add a discrete attenuator for volume control. Then, you can still mod the transport with power supply mods and transport/chassis dampening. Gee, it doesn't end does it?

[TauRus]

Originally posted by sergiohm
What model is that SA8400 ? Is it a new one as well ? The dedicated SACD player in production in the US is the SA8260 and this one has nothing to do with the DV8300/8400 and sounds much better (but is it because of the DACs, architecture or is it because it is a dedicated audio player only?).
Marantz is also producing the SA14v2 which is a 2-channel SACD only but an even better player than the SA8260, it even has balanced outputs.
I forgot to mention the SA8260 has a "temperamental" transport, that is, sometimes it takes a minute or two to go from pause to play, sometimes more than that! I believe some folks had problems with the transport in the SA14 (but have not seen anything about the SA14v2 since it has been recently been brough back to US production).
Sergiohm, I provided the link to SA8400 on the first page of this thread, as well as a link to DV8400 so that no one confuses the two. Not sure how old or new SA8400 is, but looks like it is not released in US, at least so far.
DV9500 press release says that the transport comes from SA8400, and also some audio circuitry/technology from DV12S2 which is another high end SACD/DVD player. Here are the links to both "parent" units again:
DV12S2 - http://www.marantz.jp/he/products/hometheater/dvd/dv12s2/index.shtml
SA8400 - http://www.marantz.jp/he/products/audio/sacd/sa8400/index.shtml
Sorry, all links to Japanese pages.
A little bit confusing, but one thing for sure - DV9500 seems to be a thoroughbred.

[Megalodon]

Can anyone speculate when the DV9500 will be on sale in America?

At this point I'm very tempted to return my DV8400 and get the DV9500 based on the better Cirrus Logic DAC. Does anyone thing you would actually notice an Audio improvement?

Anyways if it wont be here until November or something, I dont know if I can live without my DVD-A and SACD collection for that long. When do you guys think it will hit the stores?

Jason

[TauRus]

Megalodon, better DAC alone is no guarantee of a better audio or video, but given the heritage of this player, I think its pretty safe to speculate it will be a much better unit. It has just been announced in Japan with I believe July ship dates. We dont know if it is at all planned to be released in US and, if so, when.

[Kevin C Brown]

This is good. I was assuming that it Pioneer based. I like Pioneers for their audio, but their layer change and deinterlacers could be better. Anyway, now I will keep my eye on this guy. I saw the 12S1, 12S2 (?) once, and I could never understand why Marantz never did a universal player based on that platform. Built like a freaking tank. But looks like the 9500 will get some of that heritage. :)

[jhchen]

Hi TauRus,

You are right, one should never over speculate. As I had mention before, Marantz did not just re-bezel the 969, I'm sure they had put lots of effort in the unit, referencing Pio of not.

Over at the drive business, there are three element on the transport - 1) Mech (tray mechanism and spindle) 2) Servo controller 3) pick up heads. Add a power supplier, decoding/analog out section and a chassis, you have a CD player, if the pick up is dual and add a video decode section, you have a DVD player. Of cause it is more complicate than that, especially each section require heavy development even just integration into a player, but you get the idea.

It was interesting Marantz reference the transport from a SACD player, I assume it will be the same Mech section, the pick up had and servo if not already build for DVD format, will need to change too.

Information here is no more than 12 hrs ahead, what ever is release in Asia, you will see it the next day or sooner. I was about to buy the 969, hold back the decision when I open up the cover. I can just imagine the cover under the DV9500, better power supply for the audio section, Marantz's own audio, same solution on the scaling engine as 969 (same solution does not equal to swapping board from one chassis to another), no iLINK which keep the cost down, yet retain the HDMI for digital video.

By Q3 at the time of introduction, my only concern for DV9500 will be many player will have DCDi and upscaling out put via HDMI, at almost half the price or more, but these might not be universal player.

JHC

Originally posted by TauRus
JHC, the press release mentions SA8400 High End dedicated SACD player), not DV8400 (mid-tier universal DVD player). These are completely different beasts. I will be very surprised if SA8400 has anything common with DV8400. Look up the links I provided above, they have the specs and photos. So, again, I think unless we have credible information that this player was built on any of the Pioneer chassis (which is not a bad thing either), let us not speculate about it and confuse ourselves.
Over there in Taiwan you will probably hear more and sooner about this unit than we here. I will really appreciate if you will kindly share some facts with us.

[bwa]

Which de-interlacer are Marantz using ?

[TauRus]

Good question, but I guess no one knows for sure yet. Since Marantz belongs to the same holding company as Denon, is it possible they harmonized the components, like decoders, between the two brands? I wonder what the Secrets guys think on that issue.

[dave7]

It appears that Denon doesn't even use common components/features within their own players - at least when it comes to deinterlacing. The 2900 uses Silicone Image while the 5900 uses Faroudja. I guess they have their own criteria depending on the product and its target buyer/price-point.

[Megalodon]

Is there a Marantz rep or a place I could call that would know for sure when this player would come to the USA, and how much. I dont want to rely on the Marantz website, because I have < 30 days to return my dv8400.

[zoro]

I guess not before SEPTEMBER

[dweltman]

does someone understand HDAM's and can explain them to me? Are they considered discrete output stages? How much better are they? How would they compare to taking another player (like the 5900) and modding it with upgraded opamps, such as the OP627?

I understand that all other aspects of the players are not equal, but I am curious about this comparison.

[kmmd]

Hi dweltman,

I can't tell you much about HDAM's, but I can provide more info on mods to the 5900. After speaking with both Chris Johnson (Parts Connexion/Underwood Wally mods) and Dan Wright, both of whom I know and have experience with, the OPA627's cannot be used due to the fact that the stock 5900 OPA's are dual and the number of dual op amps needed. Each channel uses two dual OPA's. Please understand that the OPA627 is a single op amp at a MSRP of $50 each! That's $200/channel just on OPA's! :eek: As for the sound, I can't compare the two either due to the fact that there are so few modded players out there.

[Megalodon]

looking good

[TauRus]

Megalodon, thanks for the photo. I like how the 5.1 analog connectors are spaced. The folks who have screw-on type of RCA connectors will especially appreciate that. :)

[mab34]

http://www.avbuzz.com/eq/marantz9500/marantz9500.htm

Pictures of the inside of the 9500 I thought some of you might like to see.

[TauRus]

MAB34, thanks a lot for the link. Oh man, just looking at these photos makes you crave this player :) Looks exactly what doctor has prescribed.

[mab34]

TauRus - yep, can't say I'm waiting patiently. I hope it turns out as good as described. We'll see....

[dave7]

Looks very promising.

Can anyone give a real translation on the description?

What will it offer for Hi-Rez Audio BM and/or TA?

Also, what are they saying about the de-interlacer and scaler?

[Kevin C Brown]

Nice ... :)

[jjtoma]

Anyone have more info yet?

Questions about Hi Rez BM /TA &

de-interlacer/scaler?

Thanks

Jim:)

[Rob Kramer]

bump

[YvesC]

Hi,

UK release is for September.

Some more information on the upcoming Marantz DVD Players: here (http://www.homecinemachoice.com/cgi-bin/shownews.php?id=6595)

Some more information on their upcoming receivers: here (http://www.homecinemachoice.com/cgi-bin/shownews.php?id=6668)

Notice that the DV9500 will feature HDMI and no DVI, the SR8500 DVI-switching.

According to a dealer, the price in France would be around 1700 €.

I've found some nice pics here (http://www.myav.com.tw/vbb221/upload/showthread.php?s=&threadid=121619) :

http://www.watch.impress.co.jp/av/docs/20040525/marantz1.jpg

http://www.watch.impress.co.jp/av/docs/20040525/marantz2.jpg

http://www.watch.impress.co.jp/av/docs/20040525/marantz3.jpg

[YvesC]

Hi,

If anybody is interested in the Block Diagram of the DV9500, you can find it on the second page of the Japanese Product Sheet (http://www.marantz.jp/arch/CE/dv9500_catalog.pdf) :)
It seems that there will be DSD direct for SACD, though if you want BM by the Cirrus Logic CS494003, you can opt for the DSD-PCM conversion.

What exactly are the "HDAM Filter/Amp" doing after the audio dacs?

What is the "10 bit Advanced I/P Converter"? Stupid question maybe, but does it matter that it is "only" 10 bit?

Thanks,

Yves

[jjtoma]

YvesC
Thank you for the diagram.

Jim

[pnichols]

I can't comment regarding the DV9500's audio, but it sure is sporting state of the art video DAC's with those 216MHz, 14-bit (probably ADI) IC's. It doesn't get any better than this for analog video output. This surpases the Denon 5900's analog video converting. I wonder what video decoder and deinterlacer is feeding these superb video DAC's?

[YvesC]

Originally posted by pnichols
I wonder what video decoder and deinterlacer is feeding these superb video DAC's?

In view of Marantz's record of using Pioneer's video section, wouldn't the decoder and the deinterlacer be the one of the 59AVi (which also happens to use 216MHz/14bit dacs)

I remember Pioneer uses something called T-Rex, and Kris Deering wasn't to positive about it, as you can read on this thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?threadid=344531&perpage=20&highlight=trex&pagenumber=1)
The de-interlacer did the same as previous Pioneer's. It passed the film based material but failed the mixed modes and 2:2 material. The chroma bug is not present like the 563a but there is a slight flicker with Monsters Inc and I noticed banding in color on some video based menus (The Big Lebowski) that isn't there with other players tested.

The de-interlacer is motion adaptive but does not pass the Faroudja flag test like the DCDi chips do. I wasn't able to test out any of the HDMI stuff at this time.
So, I don't know if it's really a good thing... but at least it won't have the macroblocking problem ;)

Yves

[zoro]

Yves!! Bro!! Any idea MSRP USA$

[YvesC]

Hi,

On this page (http://www.dvdbase.cz/clanek.php3?clanekid=1107) you can see the inside (and close-ups of the chips:) ) of the Pioneer Elite DV-59AVI (the equivalent of the European Pioneer DV-868Ai)

As I expected, it has the same video dac ADV7314 (216 MHz/14bit) like the Marantz will have.

The scaler (of the Pioneer) is a T-REX PD0280B

The decoder (of the Pioneer) is a Mitsubishi M65776BFP MPEG2 decoder

I guess Marantz will use the same chips.

Originally posted by zoro
Yves!! Bro!! Any idea MSRP USA$

Zorro,

I live in Europe, and a French dealer said it would cost about 1700 €, so like usual the US MRSP will be well below that ;) (1400-1500$ ?)

Yves

[zoro]

Thnx Man!! I hope it will have NEWER VERSION of HDMI

[YvesC]

I hope so too (wasn't there a problem with Pioneer's HDMI output, have to make a search on these forums)!

Anyway, the audio part seems (like usual from Marantz) to be very high-end.

Some regrets, though: in spite of a digital video output, there is no iLink audio output :confused: :(
like the previous Marantz players, you seem to have to get into the on-screen menus to change the SACD layer (Denon has a button on the player AND for the new models even on the remote to do this!)


Yves

PS Has anybody got a clue what the function is of the "condition" button on the remote (on the right, last row)? Maybe this is to change the SACD layer?

[Enigma]

Maybe I missed it in this thread, but you guys keep calling this a Universal player; the literature I saw described it as DVD/SACD player, or something like that. And the pics have the SACD logo prominently displayed at the top center; I can't see a mention of DVD-A. To me it looks like this player is like the Sony's; DVD-V, CD, and SACD only; no DVD-A. Did I miss something?

[Kris Deering]

This Marantz player is not based on the Pioneer units. It is the first player built from the ground up by Marantz for both video and audio. I saw it in action at the Definitive show in Seattle, but didn't really learn much. I am arranging for one to test in a future benchmark.

The HDAM reference is Marantz's solution so that they don't use Op Amps, it is a direct coupling.

According to the Marantz rep I spoke with, this player will do DVD-A via HDMI, but I can't confirm it yet.

[zoro]

Thnx Kris!! Do u have any idea on $$ here!!

BTW!! can u pls include Onkyo/Integra SACD/DVD AUDIO changer for next SHOOT OUT?

And When it will be?

[kevinca1]

Next to the Dolby trade mark the dvd video/audio trademark is there. It also sure looks like a denon player.

[Kevin C Brown]

Somewhere earlier in this thread it was mentioned that the 9500 borrows heavily from the 12S1 player that Marantz did a while ago. *That* was one awesome player.

[zoro]

Originally posted by kevinca1
Next to the Dolby trade mark the dvd video/audio trademark is there. It also sure looks like a denon player.

Denon/Marantz Same company now!

[Ovation]

Originally posted by zoro
Denon/Marantz Same company now!

Actually, they are each owned by the same conglomerate. Much like Ford owns Volvo and Land Rover, but they are not the same company.

[YvesC]

Originally posted by Enigma
Maybe I missed it in this thread, but you guys keep calling this a Universal player; the literature I saw described it as DVD/SACD player, or something like that. And the pics have the SACD logo prominently displayed at the top center; I can't see a mention of DVD-A. To me it looks like this player is like the Sony's; DVD-V, CD, and SACD only; no DVD-A. Did I miss something?

For sure it will be a universal player (with DVD-A), just like the upcoming DV7500 and DV6500;

See:
Marantz.jp (http://www.marantz.jp/he/news/press/dv9500.shtml) (bottom of the page: specifications)
Homecinemachoice News (http://www.homecinemachoice.com/cgi-bin/shownews.php?id=6595)
Avland UK (http://www.avland.co.uk/marantz/dv9500/dv9500.htm)

[jjtoma]

Good afternoon

Here is the latest on the 9500, looking very interesting.

Jim:)

http://www.audioholics.com/cedia/cedia2004/marantzdv9500.php

[dave7]

Good news.

And it appears as though it will have BM & TA for both SACD and DVD-A. That's something the Integra and Onkyo don't have.

I just with it would be here sooner. December...doesn't that mean March/April?

[dave7]

I don't know if these have been mentioned yet:

http://www.avbuzz.com/eq/marantz9500/marantz9500.htm

http://www.hkheavs.com/hkheavs_content.php?s=news/20040628&c=index

Kind of redundant info...I know.

[jjtoma]

Hello

The Marantz 9500 is priced at $2099.

Jim:)

[vinodk]

But no i-link for that price??? I might as well wait for the new Yamaha or even go with Pioneer 59AVi.

[Ovation]

Why do you want iLink? You'd be bypassing the Marantz' DACs (which are presumably the reason for buying it in the first place). I don't get this obsession with a digital link from the player to the receiver, UNLESS the receiver has at least equal, if not better, DACs.

[dave7]

I agree with Ovation. Many of those who crave iLink really seem to want an all-in-one player/pre/pro. What happened to the idea of separates?

The exception to this could be if someone came out with a killer multichannel DAC, with all the BM/TA and any other processing one might want, that used iLink inputs and outputted via analogue. Although...it's getting complicated at that point if it ever happens. At that point, you'd be using your great player as just a transport.

It seems as though the DV9500 will have BM and TA for SACD and DVD-A, so I too wonder, "what's the point of having the iLink?"

Not to mention...getting a fantastic high end player and routing it through a receiver with iLink...seems to me either way you look at it, the receiver is the bottleneck.

[kmmd]

It is not just the DACs that make a player or pre/pro sound the way that it does. Numerous other elements are just as important...power supply, power supply filtering, analog output stages after D/A conversion, etc. As I posted way back when, Marantz is known to have very good/excellent sounding equipment with much of it due to their proprietary HDAM devices in the analog stages. With HDAM2 in this player, I suspect that it will sound even better and will most likely outperform components utilizing op amps (negative feedback and all) in their analog output stages. I do wonder how it will perform on the video aspect and am looking forward to the release of this player.

[Kevin C Brown]

Here's one reason why I would want i.Link:

I have a Pioneer 47Ai. Whether I use the BM or not in the player, to get the correct phase between my mains and the sub, I have to use a *different* setting wrt the phase knob on my sub than going through my pre/pro. And, I have seen this with 2 different pre/pros, so it's not the pre/pro's fault (the 45a also did this too, btw). If I have i.Link, the pre/pro does everything, and I don't have to worry about it.

[zeropoint]

Originally posted by dweltman
does someone understand HDAM's and can explain them to me? Are they considered discrete output stages? How much better are they? How would they compare to taking another player (like the 5900) and modding it with upgraded opamps, such as the OP627?

I understand that all other aspects of the players are not equal, but I am curious about this comparison.

HDAMs (Hyper Dynamic Amplifier Modules) are thick-film transistor discrete preamp output stages that replace the low-cost op-amps normally used in audio products and provide fast slew rate, wide bandwidth, low noise and wide dynamic range.

[vinodk]

I already have Elite 56TXi therefore I don't need a player with great analog stage & in the process avoid the cable clutter.

[Ovation]

Originally posted by Kevin C Brown
Here's one reason why I would want i.Link:

I have a Pioneer 47Ai. Whether I use the BM or not in the player, to get the correct phase between my mains and the sub, I have to use a *different* setting wrt the phase knob on my sub than going through my pre/pro. And, I have seen this with 2 different pre/pros, so it's not the pre/pro's fault (the 45a also did this too, btw). If I have i.Link, the pre/pro does everything, and I don't have to worry about it.

This is an excellent reason to want i.Link. If you're jacked in to an Elite Pioneer receiver, or other brand with high quality DACs, etc. then it's great. However, if Marantz, in this case, or anyone else goes to the trouble to design and implement an excellent audio stage, why would one then wish to bypass the whole thing? If it's only to be used as a transport, a less expensive machine with different priorities would be the one to look for.

[dave7]

Ovation is spot-on.

What a lot of you guys should really want is an advanced multi-channel transport. If they put as much time, effort and money into something like this, and it had no analogue audio output, just imagine how much simpler the electronics would be, and how much more advanced and developed the chassis, power supplies and so forth would be.

[slick316]

anyone have info on a marantz dvd player that has the scaling and a hdmi output for a more reasonable price?
i'm interested in the denon 1910, but i really want to stick with marantz and also would like to have sacd.

[dave7]

Does anyone know what Marantz is using for the de-interlacing solution?

I think price will be around $2099.

[Li On]

Hi,

Saw the DV9500 on a 100" 16x9 GrayHawk using the Mitsubishi D2010 (HC2000) HD2+ 720p DLP projector.

The HDMI output resolution is selectable between VGA (640x480), 480, 720p and 1080i in either RGB/Component. NTSC outputs in 60Hz and PAL in 50Hz. NO 480i/576i HDMI output.

It has the correct 4:3 pillarbox squeeze mode (called 16x9 squeeze). Like the Pioneer 59avi, the player will auto detect 4:3/16x9 content.

The OSD layout feels like a Pioneer model. Operation speed is fast like a Pioneer.

With some video control tweak, the picture is indeed quite stunning. Super SHARP and HIGH resolution, again like the Pioneer 59avi. Very clean and almost free of noise. Slight Chroma Bug effect, less than the 59avi. 3/2,2/2 pulldown detection is acceptable though not yet Faroudja chip quality. Video deinterlace looks quite good, maybe slightly better than the DVDO Sil504 performance.

The overall picture quality is really great. And maybe THE best so fast... I think... :D

regards,

Li On

[kmmd]

Just got an e-mail from Music Direct. This player is available now: Marantz DV 9500 (http://www.amusicdirect.com/products/detail.asp?cat=&sku=AMARADV9500)

[PooperScooper]

For another data point, it will be interesting to see if HDMI->DVI works correctly on the 9500.

larry

[dave7]

Larry,

We are waiting for your review/comments/observation on this player.;)

[timclark]

With a DLP rear projection set using DVI or HDMI (Like Samsung Hlp4663W) is the video dac on a player like the Marantz even used?

[YvesC]

Beautiful pics on http://www.avbuzz.com/eq/dvd9500/dvd95002.htm !

By the way, there is a close up photo of a "Pioneer" chip inside...

Yves

[timclark]

Originally posted by YvesC
Beautiful pics on http://www.avbuzz.com/eq/dvd9500/dvd95002.htm !

By the way, there is a close up photo of a "Pioneer" chip inside...

Yves

Boy, i'e be afraid that that quarter floating around in there would short out something....:)

[Kevin C Brown]

Yes, I didn't think that this was true... :)

Marantz built from the ground up

Can anyone comment if the menus look similar to any other player? Looks like it has Silicon Image deinterlacing, which is good. Which is strange because Pioneer has never used SI.

And...

Full bass management for SACD and DVD-A including delay

Pure DSD bitstream decoding for SACD

Based on current "state of the art", the 2nd would seem to be precluded by the 1st...

[Ovation]

Not if you set all the speakers to large and all speaker distances to same distance. I believe that's how the Denons do it.

[Kevin C Brown]

There *is* no bass management or delay in that case. Almost all universal DVD players, and all SACD/CD players have pure DSD processing in that instance. Nothing seemingly new then.

The question is: are they converting to PCM to do "full" BM and/or SACD time delay?

[dave7]

The way it is worded could mean time delay on just DVD-A and not SACD. We will have to wait for a member to get one and try it out/check the manual.

Does anyone know what the Pioneer chip is for? And - does it use SI deinterlacing...for sure? I know it has a SI chip in there, but I don't know what it is for.

Assumption could be a dangerous thing.

[Kevin C Brown]

The way it is worded could mean time delay on just DVD-A and not SACD.

I just reread it and you are exactly right. You should be a lawyer. ;)

[dave7]

I just reread it and you are exactly right. You should be a lawyer.

Kevin - If I didn't know you, I'd be pissed at you for saying that!;)

[PooperScooper]

Can anyone comment if the menus look similar to any other player? Looks like it has Silicon Image deinterlacing, which is good. Which is strange because Pioneer has never used SI.

The Sii9190 in the pic is not a deinterlacer. It's the HDMI transmitter. http://www.siimage.com/products/sii9190.asp

larry

[Kris Deering]

From the looks of the video setup menu, it is based on the 59AVi. While it would have been nice to see a Silicon Image de-interlacer, the 59AVi's Pioneer solution was quite good so this should be a big step up from the disappointing DV-8400.

[thedeskE]

YvesC
Thanks for the link. Interesting menu shot.
Somebody shell the 2K and be our first test dog!
E

[dave7]

Still waiting on Larry - the super duper demo man.

[ninja.rogue]

Is there any chance that firewire audio will ever come out from a hdmi connection?
How to connect this new player to ieee1394-enabled pre/pros (like Pioneer, Denon)?

[thedeskE]

I'll wait! It has one thing going for it. It's NOT a Denon.
I own a Denon
E

[PooperScooper]

Originally posted by dave7
Still waiting on Larry - the super duper demo man.
:) Waiting on me for what? I don't think I'll be holding out till the 5910 comes out. And at this point from what I've seen, I think I want a Silicon Image deinterlacer based player matched to my plasma. Wouldn't it be something if Denon "backtracked" and went back to using a Sii504 in the 5910? And, please don't wait for me, I can't take the pressure. :)

larry

[PooperScooper]

Originally posted by ninja.rogue
Is there any chance that firewire audio will ever come out from a hdmi connection?
How to connect this new player to ieee1394-enabled pre/pros (like Pioneer, Denon)?
No chance. HDMI and IEEE1394 need be the same on each end. Most likely the receivers will come with HDMI inputs, possibly in addition to i.Link and/or DenonLink.

larry

[Kris Deering]

I wouldn't call Denon going back to a Silicon Image de-interlacer "backtracking". Denon has publicly stated that they prefer the Silicon Image chip to the Faroudja. The Faroujda was used because Silicon Image doesn't have a scaling solution and they felt there wasn't another chip solution that would offer the performance of the Faroudja for their price point, and I agree with them.

I think the DV-9500 could be a great player. The build quality is exceptional. I wish more manufacturers would put solid audio connectors that are well spaced like this player has. If the video section is a 59AVi that has been tweaked in a bit, this will be a killer solution. It should be easy for Marantz to correct the Y/C delay the 59AVi had.

Personally I am really looking forward to checking this player out.

[PooperScooper]

Originally posted by Q of BanditZ
Amen, brutha. I'm steering clear of Faroudja myself, regardless of what I spend.


That's why a lot of people are really flipping out over the Onkyo 1000 and Integra 10.5.

It's also why the Denon 2900 is still very highly though of and why I might even get that myself.
The macroblocking isn't really the issue for me. It's just a preference of mine from what I've seen. If I had a CRT, I would probably go with Faroudja.

larry

[PooperScooper]

Originally posted by Kris Deering
I wouldn't call Denon going back to a Silicon Image de-interlacer "backtracking". Denon has publicly stated that they prefer the Silicon Image chip to the Faroudja. The Faroujda was used because Silicon Image doesn't have a scaling solution and they felt there wasn't another chip solution that would offer the performance of the Faroudja for their price point, and I agree with them.

By "backtracking" I meant like a lot of their previous models. It is interesting to know why they switched.

larry

[Kris Deering]

Plus, who said they switched. Denon hasn't announced what chipset will be used in the upcoming 5910 officially yet.

[ninja.rogue]

Originally posted by PooperScooper
No chance. HDMI and IEEE1394 need be the same on each end. Most likely the receivers will come with HDMI inputs, possibly in addition to i.Link and/or DenonLink.

larry

Thank you Larry.
This just means that there is no way to have this player to output a digital SACD/DVD-A signal any pre/pro with autoEQ on-board, isn't it?

So, when new pre/pros will come out with digital multichannel input, will new HDMI players be at an advantage with respect to "older" IEEE 1394?

In the case I wanted an all-digital-path to pre/pro, why to choose Marantz 9500 instead of Pioneer 868 (I am using a DVDO HD as a scaler/deinterlacer)? Video section seems quite similar and as far as audio is concerned, decoding would be in charge of the pre/pro. Am I wrong?

Thank you

[Kris Deering]

The 9500 is supposedly a HDMI 1.1 compatible player so it will do DVD-A via HDMI. I am sure it will support SA-CD when the licensing comes through for HDMI support. I think future A/V products will start to support HDMI more and more, as evidenced at this years CEDIA.

[PooperScooper]

Kris,
By "It is interesting to know why they switched." I was refering to SI -> Faroudja , not Faroudja ->SI. I have no idea what is in the new 5910 and it would be interesting if they did switch back to SI.

larry

[mundis]

Hook up question. I have the AVM30 and I'm planning to buy the DV9500 this week. On the rear panel of the DV9500 there are eight analog audio outs for DVD-A/SACD (2 L, 2 R, C, Sub, SL, SR). On my Anthem AVM 30 there are only six inputs (L, R, C, SL, SR). How should I hook up these units to enjoy their greatness. Or am I just missing something obvious here?

[PooperScooper]

The 9500 manual should describe 2nd L and R are for. Could be that the 2nd L and R are for 2 channel PCM output. The leaves the other 6 for the "obvious" match up on the other end.

larry

[dweltman]

I tried Babelfishing that website. Couldn't understand much, but it seemed to imply that the 9500 had visible Chroma Bug.

[dave7]

Larry-

I doubt it would have a L & R output for PCM. A PCM output would be a single digital connection...right? It is more likely that it is simply a second channel analog output.

[PooperScooper]

Isn't 2 channel stereo redbook CD output as PCM? If not, that's what I meant - too many abbreviations to keep track of :)

larry

[mrtanner]

Originally posted by mundis
Hook up question. I have the AVM30 and I'm planning to buy the DV9500 this week. On the rear panel of the DV9500 there are eight analog audio outs for DVD-A/SACD (2 L, 2 R, C, Sub, SL, SR). On my Anthem AVM 30 there are only six inputs (L, R, C, SL, SR). How should I hook up these units to enjoy their greatness. Or am I just missing something obvious here?

My use for the "extra" L+R is to feed the CD input of my receiver. [Why would you do that?] Because I listen to the 6-channel direct for my multi-channel music or stereo listening when I only want two channels, but I switch to the CD input when I want to process a two-channel source into multi-channel.

[dave7]

I think I got ya Larry.

[jjtoma]

Good morning mundis

When you get the DV-9500 connected to your AVM30
please pass along the results. Many ears & eyes are waiting.
Also which type of display you are using, along with connections
(DVI or component)?

Thanks Jim:)

[mundis]

My family room system consists of the following:
Mits 62725 DLP (delivery on Wed)
Anthem AVM30
ATI 2505 (250x5)
B&W 804 x 2
B&W 805 x2
B&W HTM1
Polk Sub (thinking about replacing)
Xbox (Component)

I plan on hooking up the DV9500 with a HDMI Cable (bluejeanscable). I'm a little hesitant purchasing this equipment without reading a review or testing it myself. One thing I'm not completely sure of is if when you use the HDMI out on the DV9500, are you still utilizing the upscaling feature? If I decide to purchase the DV9500 it will arrive with the 62725 on Wed. Unfortunately I probably won't be able to do too much testing, I'm leaving for the Bahamas on Sat (please no hurricanes). Yet I would be lying if I said that I will not be thinking of/missing my HT setup.

[jjtoma]

mundis

"One thing I'm not completely sure of is if when you use the HDMI out on the DV9500, are you still utilizing the upscaling feature? "

HDMI is the only way of upscaling video(legally). I guess component
will not upscale. Pertaining to the DV-9500. By the way, very nice setup.

Jim:)

[mundis]

Thanks for the info Jim. I just called my HT supplier and he will have one in his store tomorrow, at which time he will demo it. The salesman did not know if it could upscale through the HDMI cable and he will also look that info up in the manual.

Armed with this information I will include the DV9500 with my TV delivery on Wed.

Thank you for the compliment on my system. My wife and I love it and she wants me to get started on the basement theater right away. The work just never ends. :D

[SanMateo]

I had the pleasure of demo-ing the Marantz 9500 at the local AV shop. This is a very impressive DVD player. In a comparison, it easily beat the Pioneer Elite 59 av model. The price is a bit steep. MFRP is $1999.

[sergiohm]

Originally posted by SanMateo
I had the pleasure of demo-ing the Marantz 9500 at the local AV shop. This is a very impressive DVD player. In a comparison, it easily beat the Pioneer Elite 59 av model. The price is a bit steep. MFRP is $1999.
Is there any good logic on why the MRSP in the US is $500 more expensive than in Japan :confused:
At this price tag (and Marantz usually does not give discounts) it is hard, specially when the Denon 5910 comes out (although I think I read somewhere in this forum Denon will increase the price by $500 over the 5900).

[Ovation]

MSRPs are subject to all sorts insane variations. Example, the Marantz DV6400 MSRP in the US (at the time I purchased mine) was 600$, while the Canadian MSRP was 800$ (which is line with exchange rates). However, at that time, the Denon 2200 MSRP in the US was 640$ but in Canada it was 1195$. The Denon 2900 was 1000$US and 1895$CDN. And the 5900 was 2000$US and 3395$CDN. No relation to exchange rates at all. I guess one simply has to work with what's available in their country (that's one of the reasons I'm a proud owner of a Marantz and not the Denon 2900 that was my original choice).

[TauRus]

Originally posted by mrtanner
My use for the "extra" L+R is to feed the CD input of my receiver. [Why would you do that?] Because I listen to the 6-channel direct for my multi-channel music or stereo listening when I only want two channels, but I switch to the CD input when I want to process a two-channel source into multi-channel.
Great idea. Now I will also find some use for these extra connectors.

[thedeskE]

mundis

Any further info on the 9500?
Do you have it? Back from vacation?

E

[mundis]

Finally back from vacation, wish I was still there. I did get the DV9500 and hooked it up with component and HDMI. Still have a lot of settings to adjust but my initial impression is very positive.
DVD viewing using the component hookups appears more natural (colors) to me. Although I have not had time to use the picture settings contained within the DV9500. As far as upscaling goes, the picture in 720p/1080i has more detail than 480p. However, until I adjust the settings I prefer the 480p. I'm also still adjusting my Mits WD-62725.
This is also my first encounter with SACD/DVD-A. I purchased Pink Floyd Dark Side of the Moon, Eagles, Yes, and Mozart. Freaking awesome sound. But my current system is light years ahead of my last system (AVM30, ATI2502, B&W 804/805/HTM1). I don't have extensive experience reviewing system after system. But I know what I like and I like this setup.
Hopefully, I'll be able to spend some time with fine tuning and post some pictures. Don't hold your breath. Halo 2 comes out real soon.

[thedeskE]

mundis

Thanks! You need not be technical with you thoughts. Any emotional opinions are welcome. I hope the player comes through as a top performer. That's good news on the 480p.

E

[jjtoma]

Here's a review from Audiogon.

Jim:)

_ Marantz DV-9500 First Impressions

"This is my first comment on any audio equipment ever. I am not employed by or paid by the Marantz Company or employed by or affiliated with any aspect of the music/audio equipment industry. My interest in music has been avid since childhood with the purchase of my first stereo after a summer’s worth of hard work at the tender age of 12. 33 years later and several stereo systems later, including the first CD player, the Sony CDP-101, the Marantz DV-9500 is outstanding. The DV-9500 replaces my Sony XA-777ES. The DV-9500 projects a wide sound stage when listening to Red book CD’s and when listening to stereo SACDs the sound stage extends well beyond to almost give the impression that a 5.1 surround disc is playing. When listening to Red book CDs or SACDs there is a greater sense of depth, individual instruments and voices are more defined and have their own sense of space. The DV-9500 is significantly better than the Sony in reproduction of Redbook CDs and SACDs. This is my first Universal Player, and my first DVD player. The sound from DVD Audio and DVD Surround is excellent. The only complaint I have about the DV-9500 is that it makes a noise like it is searching for each track prior to playing a track in the DVD Surround mode. The associated equipment included Thiel 7.2’s x 5, Bryston SST 4B and SST 6B amplifiers, and a Sony TA-P9000ES preamp."
Cory

[rynopr]

Does anyone know if I were to buy this from Asia if it does the conversion from Pal to Ntsc, or will I need an external converter? The reason I would buy it from over seas is because it has multiregion capabilities and I have found a good deal.

Thanks

[zepp3lin]

As far as Asia is concern, getting a player here in Asia part is damn cheap and confirm multi region. It cost me only at about US$1000 for this MarantzDV9500. This player does both PAL and NTSC Progressive. SACDs and RedBook confirm in the HighEnd Class. This player does BM and Delay Setting on SACD/DVDA if its in PCM mode but if in DSD mode it does not. SACDs and DVDA available in HDMI output.

[Kevin C Brown]

You should check that again. It probably does not output SCAD via HDMI. No player does right now. HDMI 1.2 which would allow SACD to pass won't be available until later this year. *If* the licensing issues can be addressed. *That's* why this player not having i.Link is such a big downer.

[zepp3lin]

OK, guys sorry wrong info on the HDMI audio section cause I've just read the manual casually and it's kind of misleading. I've already check it out what this DV9500 does for this HDMI output on the Audio section.

DVDA and SACD with CPPM copyright protection both does not output any Audio out thru HDMI.

DVDA without CPPM copyright protection will only output 2 channel Downmix thru HDMI

Audio is not output from SACD. This applies to only play CD Audio part thru HDMI.
So during CD play on Hybrid SACDs it does output the Left and Right channel only.

Both DVDA and SACD, 5.1 is not possible thru HDMI as yet and I think it will be forever because of the Copyright Issues.

[AVfile]

Thanks for the report... but MAN, what a letdown about the HDMI issues! Only stereo DVD-A? I guess we're supposed to hook it up to the TV only, ha!

The Secrets review also indicated that SACD was not supported at this time via HDMI.

I noticed the manual suggests that BM is limited to Large/Small settings - what is the crossover frequency then and does it even work with SACD?? It does say speaker delay works with SACD (in the PCM domain).

At this point it's really becoming apparent that we still need seperate DVD-A and SACD machines for the perfect setup :(

I'll take an Arcam FMJ DV29 and Sony XA9000ES ;)

[armoury]

I'm currently demo-ing a Marantz 9500, which is very nice, but it doesn't seem to do the "resume" function properly after powering off (soft off, not hard button off), and this seems to be because the HDMI handshake appears to mess things up, and the disc acts as if it's just been put in.

Any owners experience this? I also find the HDMI handshake gets screwed up each time I eject the disc -- the default Marantz wallpaper (close-up of a trumpet overlaid by the SACD logo) shows up then goes back, with one or two bright blue jagged lines right across my display (Pio 434), before locking back on and displaying the Marantz wallpaper again.

Alternatively, is it possibly because the cable I'm using isn't an actual HDMI cable? The funny thing is, the dealer didn't have any on hand, he only had an HDMI-DVI cable, so he also loaned me a DVI-HDMI adapter to stick onto the DVI end, making the cable in effect an HDMI cable throughout. (Weird, eh?)

I was almost ready to commit to buying the 9500, but this "no resume" problem, coupled with no auto-detect of 4:3 material and pillarboxing, the slight mosquito noise problem, as well as the higher price compared to a 59AVi (969 here) are now swaying me to seriously consider the 59AVi instead. Although one nice plus of a 9500 is that my Marantz RC3200 universal remote that came with my SR8200 receiver controls the 9500 right off the bat, without having to "teach" it.

[zepp3lin]

My DV9500 resume function normally without any fault that your saying. Maybe you should demo another new set to confirm. There are several setting that you should look up in playing CDs and DVDs. By default the DV9500 always trying to auto lock up the dics that you are trying to put in. I think it's an issue with the fact that both must be in HDCP compatible in order for it to lock up. I did not notice any noise when it tries to play a track, maybe that player that you demo got some fault somewhere with the Optical lens.
Video wise this player can gives out better sharper picture and color saturation compare to Denon 3910. Chroma issue is a minor as you can adjust the Chroma delay in HDMI mode. For what I've known Denon 3910 don't let you do that. Pioneer 969 or 59AVi does gives out good video pics but if you compare Redbook CDs and SACDs performance Marantz can perform almost like a High End CD player and like jjtoma feedback it performs better than the Sony player in SACDs. I guess Marantz took best of both world and incorporate it into one.
Yo Armoury your from SG right?

[Martin Butler]

Just hooked up my 9500 and noticed the DVD-A output is significantly lower in volume than the coax digital out (3-6db). I am trying to compare the DAC's in the Marantz to the DAC's in my Arcam receiver and the level difference is making it quite difficult. I had the Denon 3910 previously and the coax digital out and DVD-A (SACD) outs were identical in level. I preferred the Arcam's DAC's just slightly over the Denon's. Anyone else notice this?

Anyone know of a Marantz 9500 user group at any other website? I'd love to see a thread here at AVS for 9500 owners to post to.

[zepp3lin]

[QUOTE=Martin Butler]Just hooked up my 9500 and noticed the DVD-A output is significantly lower in volume than the coax digital out (3-6db). I am trying to compare the DAC's in the Marantz to the DAC's in my Arcam receiver and the level difference is making it quite difficult. I had the Denon 3910 previously and the coax digital out and DVD-A (SACD) outs were identical in level. I preferred the Arcam's DAC's just slightly over the Denon's. Anyone else notice this?

Anyone know of a Marantz 9500 user group at any other website? I'd love to see a thread here at AVS for 9500 owners to post to.[/QUOTE]

You have to go to the DVD Setup menu mode and set the level balance on the Marantz. You have to do the balancing and distance. For the level setting if you want it to be the same as coax digital out, set the Level menu to Fix. If you happen to find it unbalance than put it to Variable mode and adjust the range in between -6db to +6db in steps of 0.5db.

Read the manual for goodness sake, than you will know practically everything about the 9500. It's not just a plug and play player, it's a tweak up UNI DVDP. There's a lot of setting to play in this 9500, you can even adjust the Chroma Delay on this player. The Denon 3910 does not include this option and alot of people out there got this Chroma bug issues with this 3910.

[Martin Butler]

Thanks Zepp3lin, that was really helpful information. It's not that I'm too lazy to read the manuaI. I had an air conditioner breakdown in the middle of a heat wave the same day my 9500 arrived and when I listened for the first time I was surprised by level differences between those inputs. Iwas curious, but pressed for time and that's why I asked for help. That's part of what these forums are for. It's great to hear from other 9500 owners. There's always a bit of a learning curve and new discoveries, so I hope members will begin posting more frequently here. I sold the Denon 3910 for some of the reasons you mentioned. I'm waiting for an HDMI to DVI adapter so I'm using component outs temporarily. I will say this for the 3910, my first impression before calibration in component output (interlaced or progressive) it seems to look better than the 9500. Perhaps the Faroudja de-interlacer is a bit better in the 3910) The CD and SACD audio on the 9500 is more refined. It resolves more detail, making words more intelligible. That's a big priority for me.
Still have a way to go before it's all dialed in..

[zepp3lin]

You will be surprize that to me 9500 is way much better picture quality than the 3910 at least for me in HDMI/DVI mode. The video looks much sharper and detail than the 3910. I had it compare side by side for both DVDP. Only thing that bothers me a bit is when the subtitle being displayed. It's not as smooth as the 3910 in Subtitle mode but than again I seldom On the subtitle mode in DVD movies.

[Martin Butler]

I was sent the wrong adapter and have to wait until Saturday or Monday for the new one to arrive. It's frustrating because I can't see the HDMI output until it arrives. At the Secrets of Home Theater website benchmark tests the 9500 failed the subtitle test. Now I've got to dig out a movie with subtitles and see what's up. I watch plenty of foreign movies and hope it's tolerable and not a deal breaker. Thanks for the mentioning that Zepp.

[zepp3lin]

Hey Martin no problem man just trying to give a bit of a view here bout the 9500. One little thing that makes me decided to buy this 9500 was because it's a Japan set, unlike Denon 3910 it's made in China. The DACs built in the 9500 sounds better than my Rotel 1066 Pre Amp Processor.

[Martin Butler]

Glad we're beginning a dialogue here. Any other 9500 owners out there? I must say I was disappointed by the remote that came with the 9500. I was expecting some version of a Marantz learning remote. I was hoping to cash in by selling my MX-500 learning remote and using a Marantz. It's not even a decent plain remote. Buttons are non intuitive and clumsy with no backlight. It's too easy to say that most people with the cash for a 9500 have some other fancy remote and don't really need a great one. One example of a first class remote is the one that came with my Arcam AVR300. It has a great tactile feel, backlighting, ergonomic button placement and learning capability. Marantz needs to know that they can't be high end and cut corners. Fifty bucks more for great remote shouldn't be too difficult for them to manage. OK, rant over, I just had to get that off my chest.

* as far as I can see, there's no "official" 9500 owners thread. Perhaps I should start one and include some of the posts here?

[zepp3lin]

Yupz ur right the 9500 remotes are crap, I learned all the codes of the Marantz to my Rotel Universal remote with Backlighting and LCD display. I guess a better Marantz Remote will only comes with the AV Receiver. My target ideal remotes is the Philips Pronto but the pricing put me off way too expensive for a Remote.

Another dissapointment in the 9500 is that it can't do upscaling in the Component only thru HDMI. Even a cheap Momitsu DVDP comes with Component upscale together with it's DVI output.

[Martin Butler]

Denon has had quite a few firmware upgrades to some of their DVD players. I've never heard of Marantz doing that. I wonder if they might change something like the lack of component upscaling in a firmware release?

[Couj]

I live in Japan. My local electronics store has the Marantz 9500N on sale for 104,000 yen (about US$950). I own the Yamaha 2500 receiver and originally planned on pairing it with the Yamaha 2500 DVD player. However, at the moment in Japan, the Yamaha seems to only be about US$100 cheaper than the price I can buy the 9500 for (maybe because the Yamaha is not in general circulation yet and the Marantz has been around for a while). Anyway, given what I have been reading on this website, it seems like the 9500 at this price is great value and is probably going to give me better performance than the Yamaha 2500. But my biggest issue is that I need a DVD player that is region free and I can't seem to find a way to make this player region free (someone has already posted a way to make the Yamaha region free). Please can someone let me know how to make the 9500 region free. I am an Australian living in Japan and I have DVDs from Australia, Japan, US and the UK. Please help.

[Martin Butler]

Wow Couj, that's 50% less than the 9500 would cost here! I wish the silver color was available here in the US, oh well, too late now anyway. Don't know of any region free hacks.

[zepp3lin]

My 9500 comes region free from the factory, but originally it's in Region2 at the back of the casing.

[apesma]

Judging by the amount of information on this player Marantz hasn't sold many. Yet I read they are coming out with a 9600 that is more expensive. That doesn't make sense.

[Martin Butler]

apesma, It's possible Marantz doesn't want to be outdone by the Denon 5910 with the new Realta chip. Since Marantz makes what many people consider the best single chip DLP projector, it makes sense they'd want to give it the best possible input.

[Kevin C Brown]

The 9600 will have i.Link though, and that's personally why I passed on the 9500.

[zepp3lin]

[QUOTE=apesma]Judging by the amount of information on this player Marantz hasn't sold many. Yet I read they are coming out with a 9600 that is more expensive. That doesn't make sense.[/QUOTE]

9500 does not make many sales due to Denon 3910 was on the market way before it and consumers does not have a chance to compare. Base on comparison that I make for both of them audio and Visual beats the 3910 at least by a few percentage if not more.

[zepp3lin]

[QUOTE=Kevin C Brown]The 9600 will have i.Link though, and that's personally why I passed on the 9500.[/QUOTE]

Actually if you can get hold of the Japanese 9500 model the i.Link connection is there.

[Fishhooks]

Is this 9500 a long way in front of say the Pio 969AVi. Like a couple of years ahead in technology, has this made a difference?
I'm presently in Asia and the 9500 is probably a few hundred US dollars dearer than the Pio, which must be getting close to a replacement also.
The Marantz 8400 is selling at almost the same price as the 969AVi here in Singapore!

[Martin Butler]

Fishooks, I'm not personally familiar with that Pioneer model, but most Pioneer DVD players have the Chroma Bug and although a very good product are not in the same class as Marantz. Zepp's right about the 3910 being available sooner. The Denon 3910 has all the features of the 9500 and a few more, like DVI and buttons for upsampling on the remote and DVD player instead of being buried in a menu somewhere. I'm not saying the Denon is better, just highly competitive considering it's $600 less expensive. The 3910's remote was well thought out as well. Those mini buttons on the 9500 remote for play and fast forward drive me nuts, and the lack of backlighting is tacky at this price range. Hopefully I'll get my MX-500 programed soon and put that half assed remote in a drawer somewhere.

I'm still breaking the 9500 in, but so far the audio is excellent. It resolves background details nicely and vocals are more intelligible than the 3910 I used to have. It's a pleasure clearly hearing words I used to have to strain to decipher.

[Martin Butler]

I'm hoping my HDMI/DVI adapter arrives today, I'm anxious to see what the 9500 can really do. The interlaced/progressive component outs doesn't seem that special to me, at least not yet.

[Fishhooks]

Thanks Martin, good info.

The 969AVi is virtually the rest of the world release model of the US 59AVi, so I would imagine the 59 story would apply to the 969 as far as most performance factors.
Interesting here in Singapore to see all these models of Pioneer, Denon and Marantz, stacked 10 high in some shops, all region free and waiting to be snapped up.
Have Denon by now had many firmware mods to the 3910, I haven't read much lately but thought there were quite a few issues with the early releases!
Marantz 8400 in silver or gold also available at much the same price as the Pio 969AVi.

[Martin Butler]

Denon's really good about getting firmware releases out quickly. It's not that they have more issues than any other company, their just trying harder.

[Martin Butler]

I spent a good part of Saturday afternoon tweaking the 9500. I'm using the HDMI out with a DVI adapter. I used Video Essentials and set it up in basically the same way as I set up my Denon 3910. I use 0 IRE and enhanced BTB and WTW levels. It may be the extra adapter (my 3910 had DVI and HDMI) but my first impression of the video picture quality of the 9500 is not as good as I'd hoped for. I see minor (but noticeable) jaggies frequently and background faces seem not quite as sharp. I left all the settings to default (centered), after I tried turning noise reduction off with poor results. So far, I have to say that my Denon 3910 via DVI was a bit sharper and cleaner. It's possible some of the raves about the 9500 are from HDMI to an HDMI capable display and since HDMI has a 10 bit color processing capability and DVI has only 8 bit processing it's possible I'm not seeing all the 9500 can deliver. I was satisfied with the Denon's PQ, but wanted an improvement in audio quality without losing video quality. Now it seems to me it's one or the other, take a small hit in video quality and have better audio, or go back to a 3910. I think it may be the Faaroudja processing I liked on the 3910. It seems the 9500 is overcoming some limitations of it's deinterlacer by filtering and processing, and that's why the slight jaggie problem. Fast motion also seems more digital and jumpy, not quite as smooth as my 3910. I'll take some more time and make an effort to tweak the 9500 a bit more. I don't have the extra cash for an ISF calibration right now.

Any thoughts?

[zepp3lin]

In Singapore the price range of Denon3910 and Marantz9500 are in the same price range about US$1000/-. Pio 969AVi adavantages is because it got an i.Link connection. Marantz9500 actually took the Pioneer chip and some others I'm not sure off and improvise it. On the audio side the Marantz9500 beats the Pio 969AVi hands down.
Only advantage of the Pio 969AVi is the price it's cheaper than the 9500 by about US$300.

[Martin Butler]

Whoa! I watched a movie with subtitles last night. I've never seen anything like it. The cheapest DVD player I've ever seen has no problem with subtitles, but the flagship of Marantz has these wierd jaggie subtitles? What the heck is going on??

Does anyone have a good contact at Marantz? This needs to be fixed pronto.

[zepp3lin]

[QUOTE=Martin Butler]Whoa! I watched a movie with subtitles last night. I've never seen anything like it. The cheapest DVD player I've ever seen has no problem with subtitles, but the flagship of Marantz has these wierd jaggie subtitles? What the heck is going on??

Does anyone have a good contact at Marantz? This needs to be fixed pronto.[/QUOTE]

I told you before right. :)
But it does not bother me because I don't use the subtitle mode. But it's good though if Marantz can fix this with a firmware, but than I don't think so.

[Martin Butler]

I tried a few more subtitled movies and they all have the stairstepping issue. It looks like the lettering from pacman.

Anyone notice that lateral motion gets a bit blurry? From my HDMI out the PQ is the best I've seen when there's little movement or in a closeup, but when there's lot's of motion it seems as if the background people get blurred.

[Martin Butler]

I contacted Marantz and am waiting for recommendations regarding the jaggie subtitles.

[Martin Butler]

Zepp, did you get the funky subtitles with component out or HDMI? Also, what resolution if HDMI.

[zepp3lin]

[QUOTE=Martin Butler]Zepp, did you get the funky subtitles with component out or HDMI? Also, what resolution if HDMI.[/QUOTE]

In HDMI 1280x780 resolution.

From your review you said that the picture wise you prefered the 3910, thats a bit strange because from my own eyes, the 9500 produce a sharper picture and color tone. The 3910 was on a dull side. Maybe different individual players does not produce the same pictures even though from the same particular models. Another fault not actually a fault but just to mention it, the layer change on 9500 is not as smooth, there's a few millisec near to a second pause during the layer change.

[Martin Butler]

Zepp, so far the 9500 looks fantastic when showing close ups or scenes without much movement, It surpasses the 3910 in that regard. It's when there's a lot a lateral motion and people moving that I notice a slight blur. The 3910 had no difficulties with that sort of movement at all. Color is another story, much dependent on calibration. My InFocus 4805 projector is known for having one of the most accurate color presentations available and the 3910's colors looked great, as does the 9500. I have noticed something subtle, my eyes feel more comfortable when watching the 9500. I don't why, but I notice more peripheral aspects of a scene from the 9500 than I did with the 3910. It makes the movie more interesting. As for the blurring, I'm not sure if the 9500 reveals more of the flaws of the DVD format or it's simply not as good as the 3910 when tracking quick motion.

[zepp3lin]

Oh ok than, actually we are comparing on 2 different resolution. Your IF 4805 native resolution is only at 848X480 and mine is at 1280X780 native resolution. there's a big difference there. So it confirms that the Marantz can perform better than the 3910 at 1280X780P native resolution.

[Martin Butler]

Zepp, maybe. Since I don't have that resolution I can't compare the two players at anything but 480i or 480p. From my seating distance at a bit more than 2X screen width, the resolution isn't that big an issue. So far, the only thing that the 3910 seemed to do better was in quick motion, left to right movements. That's still a very important aspect.

[_XipHiaS_]

Now knowing they use a Pioneer chip inside for the video, i'm curriouse which one ha's the best video :), Pioneer or Marantz. Anyone tested then side by side?

[Martin Butler]

XipHiaS, I didn't know that Marantz was using a Pioneer chip for video, thanks. I've owned two of Pioneer's flagship DVD players and seen a few of their other models. The Marantz does seem to have some of the general qualities I disliked about the Pioneer players. Pioneer's colors were seductive at first, but after extended viewing they seemed a bit hyped. Second, both Pioneer models weren't great when fast motion was happening, they couldn't maintain sharpness, similar to, but not exactly the same way a plasma set blurs with rapid motion. That may be what I'm not quite so happy about with the 9500.

Of course this is only one aspect of the 9500's performance and so far, it's preferable to the Denon 3910 but it's definitely the audio quality that edges the 3910 out. Which player is superior for DVD playback is dedebatable

Would you guys do me a favor? Play a DVD with a lot of motion and watch the peripheral characters. See if things tend to blur slightly, not because of camera focus, just from the 9500's processing. Thanks.

[_XipHiaS_]

[QUOTE=Martin Butler]XipHiaS, I didn't know that Marantz was using a Pioneer chip for video, thanks. I've owned two of Pioneer's flagship DVD players and seen a few of their other models. The Marantz does seem to have some of the general qualities I disliked about the Pioneer players. Pioneer's colors were seductive at first, but after extended viewing they seemed a bit hyped. Second, both Pioneer models weren't great when fast motion was happening, they couldn't maintain sharpness, similar to, but not exactly the same way a plasma set blurs with rapid motion. That may be what I'm not quite so happy about with the 9500.

Of course this is only one aspect of the 9500's performance and so far, it's preferable to the Denon 3910 but it's definitely the audio quality that edges the 3910 out. Which player is superior for DVD playback is dedebatable

Would you guys do me a favor? Play a DVD with a lot of motion and watch the peripheral characters. See if things tend to blur slightly, not because of camera focus, just from the 9500's processing. Thanks.[/QUOTE]

Here you go :) : http://www.avbuzz.com/eq/dvd9500/dvd95002.htm

[Martin Butler]

Wow XipHiaS! That looks amazing, thanks. Now.... I've heard of ways to get translations but I've never done it before. Any tips on how to tranlate the Japanese to English? I noticed something from Silicon Image, can you tell me what that's for?

[_XipHiaS_]

[QUOTE=Martin Butler]Wow XipHiaS! That looks amazing, thanks. Now.... I've heard of ways to get translations but I've never done it before. Any tips on how to tranlate the Japanese to English? I noticed something from Silicon Image, can you tell me what that's for?[/QUOTE]

If i'm not mistaken, i think that's for outputing the HDMI signal.
You coul'd try babelfish (http://babelfish.altavista.com/), but i don't know if it kan do the job. Can't read it myself, but love those images :).

[Martin Butler]

If it's for the HDMI out, that would be cool. I use HDMI to an DVI adapter. Silicon Image is known for having better colors. I think they use twice the color resolution as other deinterlacers.

[zepp3lin]

The website is in Chinese. They use 3 diffrent kind of chipset inside, Pioneer, Silicone and Cirrus. But no matter what chipset they use, like you said the outcome is still in the eyes of the beholder.

[Martin Butler]

I've been told that the video processing is done by the Pioneer chip and is in fact an 8 bit processor, not true 10 bit. The more I watch DVD's from the 9500, the more the video PQ keeps reminding of the Pioneer DVD player I once owned. I'm not too thrilled about that.

[zepp3lin]

And who told you that?
Have you ever test it on 1280X780 native pj?
Nope I guess not.

[steveholy300]

[QUOTE=Couj]Please can someone let me know how to make the 9500 region free. I am an Australian living in Japan and I have DVDs from Australia, Japan, US and the UK. Please help.[/QUOTE]

Any replies to this?
I'm having the same problem!
Please help.
Thanks

[zepp3lin]

I bought my machine in the Asia part of the world, even though my player printed as Region 2 at the back, but it's already Region free firmware install and warranted by Marantz.
This is where the part that Asia wins hands down on electronic goods. They really care for Asian customers because we are very demanding.