Help w/Rcvr HDMI features Needed?

[largdiag]

I just got a 2007 big screen and I now looking for a reciever but its confusing.
Id like to have surround sound if Im watching HD cable programming, or over the air programming, as well as from DVD. How is over the air surround decoding achieved. I dont see 5.1 outpus on the back of the TV.

Since this TV has HDMI was wondering what features the receiver should have?
Do recievers pull 5.1 or 6.1 audio off of the HDMI? If so do I needed a receiver that has HDMI passthru.

There are 3 audio sources:
a) DVD Player w/HDMI, discrete 5.1 audio out too
b) DVR for cable w/HDMI (motorola), think it also has discrete 5.1 outs
c) TV itself has:
2 HDMI inputs
Digital Audio Output (Dolby® Digital / PCM) 1 (coaxial)
Stereo Audio Output 1 (fixed)
Record A/V Output 1
doesnt look like it has 5.1 descrete outputs.

Any tips appreciated!
thanks!

[Tarheel72]

No, not all receivers process audio via HDMI, some just act as a HDMI switcher. And as for the TV, does your TV have a built in decoder or does it simply pass through a DD signal? And if it passes them through, which inputs does it allow pass through from?

First off, you have the option of sending the audio and video signal from the DVD and the DVR to the display direct or routing it via the AVR. If you use the AVR, then it may or may not process the audio signal. If it is only acting as a switcher, then you will still need to get the audio to the AVR with a normal method, probably either optical or coax. The main reason in the past for running your video through the AVR was to decrease cables, and use the AVR as a true A/V switcher. However, with the advent of HDMI, you are now able to transmit both audio and video on one cable, and in the future HD-DVD/Blu Ray will allow for Dolby True HD, which can use HDMI. Some current displays seem to have problems receiving the video "second hand" like this, so that may also be an issue.

You can use the 5.1 or 7.1 analog inputs (which probably are not there on the DVR) but a lot of AVR's do not allow for the bass management system to function on the analog inputs, and they only have one set of inputs so you could not eaisly use both the DVD and DVR, even if both have it available.

Also, not all displays will decode and pass out DD signals from all inputs. If they have a built in ATSC tuner, they should output a DD signal from OTA sources, but that does not mean they would from a DVD or STB input via HDMI. I personally do not know of a display that has discrete 5.1 analog outputs, but there may be one out there. Obviously, it would have to have internal decoders to do this.

One sure fire way of doing what you want to do it to plan on running the video direct to the display, via HDMI. Then run the audio direct to the AVR, via optical or coaxil (or analog if you prefer and it is available, probably from the DVD) Run the digital audio out from the TV to the AVR and you can use it for OTA DD signals. Set the video input with the TV and the audio input with the AVR, and you should be fine. If your TV will pass a DD signal from HDMI inputs, that can eliminate the audio connection from the DVD and DVR to the AVR, and you can use the TV coaxial output to get the sound to the AVR for processing.

If you prefer to use the AVR as both a video and audio switcher/selector, then get an AVR with at least two HDMI inputs, and preferably three. They will be 1.1, as 1.3 is not really available yet until next year, so that is a consideration. Connect the DVD and DVR via HDMI to the AVR, and the AVR to the TV via one HDMI and confirm that the display can establish a firm handshake with the two sources. Make sure your AVR will process the audio received via the HDMI inputs, and set your processing preferences. Run a digital coax out for the TV to the receiver for OTA audio and set the AVR to that input when watching OTA sources.

Hope this all makes sense.

[largdiag]

[QUOTE=Tarheel72]No, not all receivers process audio via HDMI, some just act as a HDMI switcher. And as for the TV, does your TV have a built in decoder or does it simply pass through a DD signal? And if it passes them through, which inputs does it allow pass through from?

First off, you have the option of sending the audio and video signal from the DVD and the DVR to the display direct or routing it via the AVR. If you use the AVR, then it may or may not process the audio signal. If it is only acting as a switcher, then you will still need to get the audio to the AVR with a normal method, probably either optical or coax. The main reason in the past for running your video through the AVR was to decrease cables, and use the AVR as a true A/V switcher. However, with the advent of HDMI, you are now able to transmit both audio and video on one cable, and in the future HD-DVD/Blu Ray will allow for Dolby True HD, which can use HDMI. Some current displays seem to have problems receiving the video "second hand" like this, so that may also be an issue.

You can use the 5.1 or 7.1 analog inputs (which probably are not there on the DVR) but a lot of AVR's do not allow for the bass management system to function on the analog inputs, and they only have one set of inputs so you could not eaisly use both the DVD and DVR, even if both have it available.

Also, not all displays will decode and pass out DD signals from all inputs. If they have a built in ATSC tuner, they should output a DD signal from OTA sources, but that does not mean they would from a DVD or STB input via HDMI. I personally do not know of a display that has discrete 5.1 analog outputs, but there may be one out there. Obviously, it would have to have internal decoders to do this.

One sure fire way of doing what you want to do it to plan on running the video direct to the display, via HDMI. Then run the audio direct to the AVR, via optical or coaxil (or analog if you prefer and it is available, probably from the DVD) Run the digital audio out from the TV to the AVR and you can use it for OTA DD signals. Set the video input with the TV and the audio input with the AVR, and you should be fine. If your TV will pass a DD signal from HDMI inputs, that can eliminate the audio connection from the DVD and DVR to the AVR, and you can use the TV coaxial output to get the sound to the AVR for processing.

If you prefer to use the AVR as both a video and audio switcher/selector, then get an AVR with at least two HDMI inputs, and preferably three. They will be 1.1, as 1.3 is not really available yet until next year, so that is a consideration. Connect the DVD and DVR via HDMI to the AVR, and the AVR to the TV via one HDMI and confirm that the display can establish a firm handshake with the two sources. Make sure your AVR will process the audio received via the HDMI inputs, and set your processing preferences. Run a digital coax out for the TV to the receiver for OTA audio and set the AVR to that input when watching OTA sources.

Hope this all makes sense.[/QUOTE]


Yes it makes sense. I understand the "sure Fire way". I have to look for a receiver that accepts the type of qty of audio outputs I have for the DVR, DVD and TV. Its a minor inconvenience I guess to swith audio each time you change video, but I suppose there is a way to get a learning remote to make everything swith at once.
Any thoughts on a reciever in the <$500 category or where to start looking online. Maybe to line them up and compare features like audio inputs, qty and types?

thanks again for the very informative help!

[Tarheel72]

I can't help at that price point. I would be surprised if you found a good receiver at that level with the number of HDMI inputs that you want. If you raise your budget a little or forego the HDMI for now, you can get something more in line with what you want. For instance, you can get a brand new HK635 for under $600, that retails for around $1200. It was just replaced with the 645. The 635 had component, the 645 HDMI. I suggest looking at some HT buying guides for starters.

As for remotes, any of the Harmony remotes will easily do what you are asking, using user programed marcos.

[largdiag]

[QUOTE=Tarheel72]I can't help at that price point. I would be surprised if you found a good receiver at that level with the number of HDMI inputs that you want. If you raise your budget a little or forego the HDMI for now, you can get something more in line with what you want. For instance, you can get a brand new HK635 for under $600, that retails for around $1200. It was just replaced with the 645. The 635 had component, the 645 HDMI. I suggest looking at some HT buying guides for starters.

As for remotes, any of the Harmony remotes will easily do what you are asking, using user programed marcos.[/QUOTE]

OK. Yea. now I can see I can do without HDMI. I carefully looked that the component audio outputs and found I need:

1) Coax (Dolby Digital/PCM) from TV
2) SPDIF from DVR
3) Coax or Optical from DVD (should be same for future HD DVD).

Ill take a look at the HK635. Does any site have a side by side comparison ....check mulitple recievers to compare?

thanks again!

[largdiag]

Is SPDIF optical the same as when an output is just stated as optical?

thanks again!

[PAD]

Yes. Optical and Coax Digital are the same. Just chose the one you want to use.

[Tarheel72]

I have never seen SPDIF paired with optical, just coaxial. You usually have a choice of either optical or coaxial/SPDIF for DD audio. Either will work fine and the DVD and STB should both have each option for audio out. The TV will very likely only use optical outputs for DD audio.

[largdiag]

[QUOTE=Tarheel72]I have never seen SPDIF paired with optical, just coaxial. You usually have a choice of either optical or coaxial/SPDIF for DD audio. Either will work fine and the DVD and STB should both have each option for audio out. The TV will very likely only use optical outputs for DD audio.[/QUOTE]

THe SPDIF is on the DVR. When I open the little door there is an LED inside so I was guessing that was optical. The DVR is a motorola 6416.

You dont think that falls in the standard optical or coax category. I found the spec sheet and it says: Left/right baseband, optical and coaxial S/PDIF.

The picture shows a coax SPDIF but I thinkt he version the cable company has its gone......only the optical.